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Middle East/All : Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

 

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rrraphy
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Retired Consultant APS#186030

17 Apr 2015
07:40:29pm

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This is just about Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps. I know about Yemen o/p counterfeits, but not about these stamps.

Does anyone know how to recognize counterfeits of Yemen #1-3. Also, they come per my catalog, in both Laid paper and Wove paper, but is there a prevalence of fakes in one, rather than the other? (I assume the Wove paper which came later?)
Also, do you have an easy trick to tell the two types of papers apart.
Finally, it is stated in my research (forgot to copy the source) that counterfeits of Yemen #1-3 are laser prints. Should that make it easier to tell them apart from the real stuff (I have never seen them anywhere so I would not know what to look for), and should a dealer be able to confirm the printing method rather easily?
Thanks for enlightening me.
Rrr...
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"E. Rutherford: All science is either physics or stamp collecting."
michael78651

17 Apr 2015
11:01:42pm
re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Laid paper will have either vertical or horizontal "ribbing" visible in the paper when you hold it up to light. I don't know off-hand which type of laid paper the Yemen stamps were printed on.

The introduction to the Scott catalogs has illustrations and explanations of the many different paper types used in stamp production.

P.S. - My counterfeit reference material does not have any information on stamps from Yemen.

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rrraphy
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Retired Consultant APS#186030

18 Apr 2015
12:00:37am

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re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

These are the stamps I am trying to assess. (#1 and #3)
Would love to see an image, Nelson.

Image Not Found
Image Not Found

Michael, most counterfeits are on wove paper, and use laser printing..per my sources. That is why I would want laid paper, but even then , it is no guarantee. Hard to decide by remote control, and I must rely on the limited knowledge of this seller.

rrr..

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"E. Rutherford: All science is either physics or stamp collecting."
khj
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18 Apr 2015
01:36:03am
re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Nelson is correct, the great majority of genuine stamps are printed on horizontal laid paper. Probably less than 10% on vertical laid paper, and much less than 10% on wove paper.

Your top stamp is actually #3 (5 bogaches), not #1.
Your bottom stamp is actually #2 (2½ bogaches), not #3.

There are differences in plate positions, which is either a plus or minus, depending on how you look at it! So it's difficult to simply go by breaks in the frame line, different stroke lengths... to try to ID a forgery.

Your top stamp is more complete in design than most I've seen. On all the genuine stamps I've seen, there is a break in the "hockey stick" in the left dagger. Yours is very complete. I'd be interested in knowing if Nelson had any plate positions with a continuous "hockey stick".

Your bottom stamp is missing some elements, which (to me) is unusual for such a clean stamp. It would seem questionable to me, but I don't have enough experience to say either way.




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khj
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18 Apr 2015
01:45:14am
re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Well I did a quick search of "on piece" used examples from "reputable" dealers. I do see a #3 that has a "hockey stick" with no breaks. So I guess there is/are position(s) on the sheet with no breaks in the "hockey stick". Learned something new.

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nl1947

18 Apr 2015
07:15:32am
re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Here is a full sheet of #3
It looks like sheets were 20 stamps not 25 as I remembered?? (edited)
Yours appears to be the middle top row
If so it is one of the top quality positions.
The "hockey stick" appears from complete to missing on the sheet.

Image Not Found


As for your #3, it is not one of the better ones. There are noted elements missing. The color?? - I hope this is just the scan. The only one that comes close is the 4th top row.

This is what I have of #2 - not a full sheet

Image Not Found


Edited: As for recognizing the laser print. I don't know if a dealer is qualified unless he has copies. A person in the printing trade might be better.
Laser printers use static electricity and a laser to melt the powdered ink onto the paper so with my own experience there is no bleed through or smudging as with liquid ink - so good magnification should tell the story.


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rrraphy
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Retired Consultant APS#186030

18 Apr 2015
10:19:52am

Approvals
re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Thank you so much. Very informative, confirming my doubts, and I do think I will pass on any internet purchase and try to lay my hands on the stamps before deciding. Nelson, great sheets and thanks for taking the time to share. Kim, so nice to have you back with this unmatched expertise.
Rrr..

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"E. Rutherford: All science is either physics or stamp collecting."
khj
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18 Apr 2015
12:15:49pm
re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Thanks for uploading the pics, nl1847!

Yes, 20 stamps is the full sheet.

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khj
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18 Apr 2015
12:20:28pm
re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

The originals were typographed, which should make it distinguishable from laser-printed forgeries. But of course, you would need to have the stamps in hand.

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rrraphy
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Retired Consultant APS#186030

30 Sep 2015
12:46:32pm

Approvals
re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Here is another (and another) that looks suspect (well they all do to me). Any opinion? Appreciate the help.
rrr...

Image Not Found


Image Not Found

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"E. Rutherford: All science is either physics or stamp collecting."
        

 

Author/Postings
Members Picture
rrraphy

Retired Consultant APS#186030
17 Apr 2015
07:40:29pm

Approvals

This is just about Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps. I know about Yemen o/p counterfeits, but not about these stamps.

Does anyone know how to recognize counterfeits of Yemen #1-3. Also, they come per my catalog, in both Laid paper and Wove paper, but is there a prevalence of fakes in one, rather than the other? (I assume the Wove paper which came later?)
Also, do you have an easy trick to tell the two types of papers apart.
Finally, it is stated in my research (forgot to copy the source) that counterfeits of Yemen #1-3 are laser prints. Should that make it easier to tell them apart from the real stuff (I have never seen them anywhere so I would not know what to look for), and should a dealer be able to confirm the printing method rather easily?
Thanks for enlightening me.
Rrr...

Like
Login to Like
this post

"E. Rutherford: All science is either physics or stamp collecting."
michael78651

17 Apr 2015
11:01:42pm

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Laid paper will have either vertical or horizontal "ribbing" visible in the paper when you hold it up to light. I don't know off-hand which type of laid paper the Yemen stamps were printed on.

The introduction to the Scott catalogs has illustrations and explanations of the many different paper types used in stamp production.

P.S. - My counterfeit reference material does not have any information on stamps from Yemen.

Like
Login to Like
this post
Members Picture
rrraphy

Retired Consultant APS#186030
18 Apr 2015
12:00:37am

Approvals

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

These are the stamps I am trying to assess. (#1 and #3)
Would love to see an image, Nelson.

Image Not Found
Image Not Found

Michael, most counterfeits are on wove paper, and use laser printing..per my sources. That is why I would want laid paper, but even then , it is no guarantee. Hard to decide by remote control, and I must rely on the limited knowledge of this seller.

rrr..

Like
Login to Like
this post

"E. Rutherford: All science is either physics or stamp collecting."
Members Picture
khj

18 Apr 2015
01:36:03am

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Nelson is correct, the great majority of genuine stamps are printed on horizontal laid paper. Probably less than 10% on vertical laid paper, and much less than 10% on wove paper.

Your top stamp is actually #3 (5 bogaches), not #1.
Your bottom stamp is actually #2 (2½ bogaches), not #3.

There are differences in plate positions, which is either a plus or minus, depending on how you look at it! So it's difficult to simply go by breaks in the frame line, different stroke lengths... to try to ID a forgery.

Your top stamp is more complete in design than most I've seen. On all the genuine stamps I've seen, there is a break in the "hockey stick" in the left dagger. Yours is very complete. I'd be interested in knowing if Nelson had any plate positions with a continuous "hockey stick".

Your bottom stamp is missing some elements, which (to me) is unusual for such a clean stamp. It would seem questionable to me, but I don't have enough experience to say either way.




Like
Login to Like
this post
Members Picture
khj

18 Apr 2015
01:45:14am

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Well I did a quick search of "on piece" used examples from "reputable" dealers. I do see a #3 that has a "hockey stick" with no breaks. So I guess there is/are position(s) on the sheet with no breaks in the "hockey stick". Learned something new.

Like
Login to Like
this post
nl1947

18 Apr 2015
07:15:32am

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Here is a full sheet of #3
It looks like sheets were 20 stamps not 25 as I remembered?? (edited)
Yours appears to be the middle top row
If so it is one of the top quality positions.
The "hockey stick" appears from complete to missing on the sheet.

Image Not Found


As for your #3, it is not one of the better ones. There are noted elements missing. The color?? - I hope this is just the scan. The only one that comes close is the 4th top row.

This is what I have of #2 - not a full sheet

Image Not Found


Edited: As for recognizing the laser print. I don't know if a dealer is qualified unless he has copies. A person in the printing trade might be better.
Laser printers use static electricity and a laser to melt the powdered ink onto the paper so with my own experience there is no bleed through or smudging as with liquid ink - so good magnification should tell the story.


Like 
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
Members Picture
rrraphy

Retired Consultant APS#186030
18 Apr 2015
10:19:52am

Approvals

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Thank you so much. Very informative, confirming my doubts, and I do think I will pass on any internet purchase and try to lay my hands on the stamps before deciding. Nelson, great sheets and thanks for taking the time to share. Kim, so nice to have you back with this unmatched expertise.
Rrr..

Like
Login to Like
this post

"E. Rutherford: All science is either physics or stamp collecting."
Members Picture
khj

18 Apr 2015
12:15:49pm

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Thanks for uploading the pics, nl1847!

Yes, 20 stamps is the full sheet.

Like
Login to Like
this post
Members Picture
khj

18 Apr 2015
12:20:28pm

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

The originals were typographed, which should make it distinguishable from laser-printed forgeries. But of course, you would need to have the stamps in hand.

Like
Login to Like
this post
Members Picture
rrraphy

Retired Consultant APS#186030
30 Sep 2015
12:46:32pm

Approvals

re: Yemen #1-3 1926 for Domestic use stamps.

Here is another (and another) that looks suspect (well they all do to me). Any opinion? Appreciate the help.
rrr...

Image Not Found


Image Not Found

Like
Login to Like
this post

"E. Rutherford: All science is either physics or stamp collecting."
        

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