Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
03:52:26pm
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That happens quite often I write back saying *when the item arrives I will give feedback*
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Never get them. I do have a place on my dashboard that says feedbacks owed BUT since my feedback is automated - you get it automatically when you leave it, I guess ebay takes that into account
Greg
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I have rarely left a feedback in years and after a while I think that eBay figured it out and stopped sending me these notices (thank goodness).
I don't leave feedbacks because I think that they are merely a marketing tool for eBay. Here are the reasons I think this:
- You can have them removed. There is no legitimate feedback system that allows this to occur. Since no one can tell how many feedbacks have been removed, especially for the bigger sellers who have eBay's ear more than the smaller seller, they cannot be trusted. Even if a feedback is wrong, it is still important to show it. For example, does anyone really think it is possible to do 50,000 transactions and not have at least some unreasonable people get mad? As a brick-and-mortar store owner for years, I know for sure that it is impossible to deal with the general public and not run into problems with some people.
- Anyone can go buy an existing eBay account with high 100% feedbacks. So a NARUed eBay seller, or a convicted fraudster, can simply go buy an existing eBay account (simply search online to find many websites which sell them). I cannot trust that the feedbacks I see from an unknow seller as being real.
- eBay has no way to actually vet anyone. They are not going to visit every physical address nor can they validate multiple bank accounts and who owns them. So tens of thousands of people have dozens of accounts and they can use them to build fake feedbacks. You can see these if you look for them; simply look for sellers who have hundreds of small transactions. It is worth it to invest in buying from themselves with the purpose of building their feedback scores.
- eBay controls the feedbacks, this is the fox guarding the hen house. It benefits eBay for sellers and buyers to have high feedbacks. eBay is highly incentivized to have high feedbacks since an important part of their business model is to get us to buy from unknown people halfway around the world.
There are other reasons but I won't bore folks with more...
Don
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How do you get feedbacks removed? I have 3 feedbacks on my record, left by a customer in Portugal who claimed non-delivery of her stamps, it was a pretty significant order ($15 - most of my orders are small as I run penny start auctions on cheaper material and my store items start at $1) , I even refunded them and they still left me negative feedback, which I could only respond to and respond to only once (the stamps showed up a few months later in my PO Box as non deliverable). They are still on eBay too, but their feedback rating is now "private".
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You have to call them and talk to them, typically right after the transaction occurs. Explain your position and/or be one of the 'big boys' (who can have their own eBay account contacts). They remove them.
The point of a feedback system is not to work around it (including telling buyers to contact them first before doing a feedback). The point is to capture accurate data. At my company, we once fired a Quality Manager because he did the same thing on our manufacturing floor. After he took over, our monthly QA reports started showing 0% failures. Knowing this was not possible, we asked him about it and he admitted that he was capturing the failures at the end of the production line, fixing them, and then running them back through final testing.
We were losing large amounts of critical data, but hey, he and manufacturing were looking 'good'. That data loss could have led us to losing millions of dollars. So he packed up his belongings by the end of the day.
I understand why people want to work around eBays feedback systemit; they think that not having 100% is important. It is not. What is important is how they respond to the negative feedback. If a buyer is being a jerk, keep the feedback and make your case. Removing data always makes it illegitimate. eBay isn't stupid, they know this but they are intentionally allowing manipulation of the data because they want higher profits.
Don
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Don, here's my feedback story. Here is me:
I never had a less than positive feedback in all my years. This is my second selling account, so I probably have over 5000 feedback rating since I started back in 1997 or so.
Back in the spring, I suddenly had a negative feedback! It was over a dollar cover! The guy didn't understand that a 66 year old first day cover will have toned a bit under the best conditions, and Artcraft envelope glue often turns brown and sometimes can be visible from the front. It was also custom for people to either seal their cover, sometimes even sealing the flap inside the envelope.
This numpty never contacts me. If he did, right or wrong, I would've told him to keep the cover and I would have refunded the amount. Or if he wanted I would've sent a pristine same cover from my own collection. Nope, he fires away with nasty feedback. He pretty much says I'm selling moldy old covers and hiding the details in my listings! Note I have a full 5 stars for Accurate Description... in fact I have 5 stars in all the metrics! And that's across over 5,500 sales according to my store header.
My listings all have high resolution scans that actually make the covers look worse than they are. The faint glue stain and toning were visible in the photo. My listings always state "Never Sealed- No markings on back", "Cover is sealed", "Cover flap sealed inside" etc. ON the Mobile App the link for description is small and under ads, so sellers feel that the buyers never read it and just depend on the photo and text in the listing line.
I contact eBay with the Feedback Retraction Request. I explained that he made false claims in the negative. That indeed the faults he described (and trumped up!) were visible in the photos and mentioned in the text. They apparently went back to the numpty and asked him to retract the feedback. He refused, so eBay tells me basically to suck it up. The buyer is "entitled to an opinion". The eBay community tells me to forget about it. One negative won't make any difference. It would roll off my page after a month.
So here's what 99.9% positive feedback looks like on the "Promoted Listings" that I pay for. Note everyone else is 100% positive, even the owner of that gem of a photo! If you aren't an astute eBayer, you will go for the 100% listing! Something must be wrong with the 99.9% one!
And recently eBay changed the feedback displayed to what their AI decides is "most relevant". The below image is what shows when you click on one of my listings on the Mobile App. Note that that Negative that is over 6 months old appears as the second or third feedback every time! That is absolutely sabotaging my business!
So indeed one Negative does count!
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Hi Tom,
Understood.
If people get duped by eBays marketing ploy to falsely promote confidence by manipulated feedback scores, there is only so much that can be done. The one thing that can be done is education, I think that education is the only weapon in the war for well-informed buyers. And that was why I posted my opinion above. Folks can ignore the inane eBay feedback system, or they can embrace it like it is meaningful.
The experience you mention supports my premise that eBay feedback system is inconsistent. If you had them on the phone, you could have asked the person to connect you to an account manager. eBay's methodology is simple, they do whatever saves them time and money. Spending their time on the transaction you mention put them in the red, elevating the issue to a manger would cost them even more money. I find eBay tolerance limit is about $400-$500 dollars before they get hardline.
Note: forget using the online forms, you have to call them to get this done. They typically will put you in a phone queue and offer to call you back. I always call, and they have always gotten back to me within a short period of time. Of course, I am like you, a tiny account compared to the larger sellers who get feedbacks removed with few, if any, questions. I had a seller 'dox' me (put my real name in a feedback), I called eBay and they removed it while I was on the call with them.
But the points I made above clearly illustrate why eBay feedbacks cannot be trusted. Yes, it sucks for the large percentage of decent folks like yourself.
Don
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Very interesting - I wonder how many people actually use the mobile app to purchase from eBay. I honestly seldom look at it on my phone. I note the default feedback sort on mobile is 'Most relevant' rather than 'Most recent' which is what I see online. My negatives are still in the main screen for past 12 months but as they were given nearly a year ago, my 99.9% just switched back to 100%. Thankfully they don't show up at the top of mine on mobile as yours do.
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The value is ebay feedback is not the positive comments but what makes it into the negative.
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This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
16 Nov 2023
03:52:26pm
I just got an e-mail from E-Bay reminding me that I have four feedbacks owing!! None of these items have arrived yet and I wonder if the same email is sent to sellers about feedback since I could name a few that never give feedback to their buyers!! I was a bit ticked to read the email, to say the least. I realize that it is automatic but I was still annoyed!
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07:03:14pm
re: An annoying message from E-Bay
That happens quite often I write back saying *when the item arrives I will give feedback*
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Approvals
re: An annoying message from E-Bay
Never get them. I do have a place on my dashboard that says feedbacks owed BUT since my feedback is automated - you get it automatically when you leave it, I guess ebay takes that into account
Greg
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re: An annoying message from E-Bay
I have rarely left a feedback in years and after a while I think that eBay figured it out and stopped sending me these notices (thank goodness).
I don't leave feedbacks because I think that they are merely a marketing tool for eBay. Here are the reasons I think this:
- You can have them removed. There is no legitimate feedback system that allows this to occur. Since no one can tell how many feedbacks have been removed, especially for the bigger sellers who have eBay's ear more than the smaller seller, they cannot be trusted. Even if a feedback is wrong, it is still important to show it. For example, does anyone really think it is possible to do 50,000 transactions and not have at least some unreasonable people get mad? As a brick-and-mortar store owner for years, I know for sure that it is impossible to deal with the general public and not run into problems with some people.
- Anyone can go buy an existing eBay account with high 100% feedbacks. So a NARUed eBay seller, or a convicted fraudster, can simply go buy an existing eBay account (simply search online to find many websites which sell them). I cannot trust that the feedbacks I see from an unknow seller as being real.
- eBay has no way to actually vet anyone. They are not going to visit every physical address nor can they validate multiple bank accounts and who owns them. So tens of thousands of people have dozens of accounts and they can use them to build fake feedbacks. You can see these if you look for them; simply look for sellers who have hundreds of small transactions. It is worth it to invest in buying from themselves with the purpose of building their feedback scores.
- eBay controls the feedbacks, this is the fox guarding the hen house. It benefits eBay for sellers and buyers to have high feedbacks. eBay is highly incentivized to have high feedbacks since an important part of their business model is to get us to buy from unknown people halfway around the world.
There are other reasons but I won't bore folks with more...
Don
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re: An annoying message from E-Bay
How do you get feedbacks removed? I have 3 feedbacks on my record, left by a customer in Portugal who claimed non-delivery of her stamps, it was a pretty significant order ($15 - most of my orders are small as I run penny start auctions on cheaper material and my store items start at $1) , I even refunded them and they still left me negative feedback, which I could only respond to and respond to only once (the stamps showed up a few months later in my PO Box as non deliverable). They are still on eBay too, but their feedback rating is now "private".
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this post
re: An annoying message from E-Bay
You have to call them and talk to them, typically right after the transaction occurs. Explain your position and/or be one of the 'big boys' (who can have their own eBay account contacts). They remove them.
The point of a feedback system is not to work around it (including telling buyers to contact them first before doing a feedback). The point is to capture accurate data. At my company, we once fired a Quality Manager because he did the same thing on our manufacturing floor. After he took over, our monthly QA reports started showing 0% failures. Knowing this was not possible, we asked him about it and he admitted that he was capturing the failures at the end of the production line, fixing them, and then running them back through final testing.
We were losing large amounts of critical data, but hey, he and manufacturing were looking 'good'. That data loss could have led us to losing millions of dollars. So he packed up his belongings by the end of the day.
I understand why people want to work around eBays feedback systemit; they think that not having 100% is important. It is not. What is important is how they respond to the negative feedback. If a buyer is being a jerk, keep the feedback and make your case. Removing data always makes it illegitimate. eBay isn't stupid, they know this but they are intentionally allowing manipulation of the data because they want higher profits.
Don
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this post
re: An annoying message from E-Bay
Don, here's my feedback story. Here is me:
I never had a less than positive feedback in all my years. This is my second selling account, so I probably have over 5000 feedback rating since I started back in 1997 or so.
Back in the spring, I suddenly had a negative feedback! It was over a dollar cover! The guy didn't understand that a 66 year old first day cover will have toned a bit under the best conditions, and Artcraft envelope glue often turns brown and sometimes can be visible from the front. It was also custom for people to either seal their cover, sometimes even sealing the flap inside the envelope.
This numpty never contacts me. If he did, right or wrong, I would've told him to keep the cover and I would have refunded the amount. Or if he wanted I would've sent a pristine same cover from my own collection. Nope, he fires away with nasty feedback. He pretty much says I'm selling moldy old covers and hiding the details in my listings! Note I have a full 5 stars for Accurate Description... in fact I have 5 stars in all the metrics! And that's across over 5,500 sales according to my store header.
My listings all have high resolution scans that actually make the covers look worse than they are. The faint glue stain and toning were visible in the photo. My listings always state "Never Sealed- No markings on back", "Cover is sealed", "Cover flap sealed inside" etc. ON the Mobile App the link for description is small and under ads, so sellers feel that the buyers never read it and just depend on the photo and text in the listing line.
I contact eBay with the Feedback Retraction Request. I explained that he made false claims in the negative. That indeed the faults he described (and trumped up!) were visible in the photos and mentioned in the text. They apparently went back to the numpty and asked him to retract the feedback. He refused, so eBay tells me basically to suck it up. The buyer is "entitled to an opinion". The eBay community tells me to forget about it. One negative won't make any difference. It would roll off my page after a month.
So here's what 99.9% positive feedback looks like on the "Promoted Listings" that I pay for. Note everyone else is 100% positive, even the owner of that gem of a photo! If you aren't an astute eBayer, you will go for the 100% listing! Something must be wrong with the 99.9% one!
And recently eBay changed the feedback displayed to what their AI decides is "most relevant". The below image is what shows when you click on one of my listings on the Mobile App. Note that that Negative that is over 6 months old appears as the second or third feedback every time! That is absolutely sabotaging my business!
So indeed one Negative does count!
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re: An annoying message from E-Bay
Hi Tom,
Understood.
If people get duped by eBays marketing ploy to falsely promote confidence by manipulated feedback scores, there is only so much that can be done. The one thing that can be done is education, I think that education is the only weapon in the war for well-informed buyers. And that was why I posted my opinion above. Folks can ignore the inane eBay feedback system, or they can embrace it like it is meaningful.
The experience you mention supports my premise that eBay feedback system is inconsistent. If you had them on the phone, you could have asked the person to connect you to an account manager. eBay's methodology is simple, they do whatever saves them time and money. Spending their time on the transaction you mention put them in the red, elevating the issue to a manger would cost them even more money. I find eBay tolerance limit is about $400-$500 dollars before they get hardline.
Note: forget using the online forms, you have to call them to get this done. They typically will put you in a phone queue and offer to call you back. I always call, and they have always gotten back to me within a short period of time. Of course, I am like you, a tiny account compared to the larger sellers who get feedbacks removed with few, if any, questions. I had a seller 'dox' me (put my real name in a feedback), I called eBay and they removed it while I was on the call with them.
But the points I made above clearly illustrate why eBay feedbacks cannot be trusted. Yes, it sucks for the large percentage of decent folks like yourself.
Don
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re: An annoying message from E-Bay
Very interesting - I wonder how many people actually use the mobile app to purchase from eBay. I honestly seldom look at it on my phone. I note the default feedback sort on mobile is 'Most relevant' rather than 'Most recent' which is what I see online. My negatives are still in the main screen for past 12 months but as they were given nearly a year ago, my 99.9% just switched back to 100%. Thankfully they don't show up at the top of mine on mobile as yours do.
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re: An annoying message from E-Bay
The value is ebay feedback is not the positive comments but what makes it into the negative.
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