Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
I will take good care of the stamps in my possession. I will not damage or alter them in any way. I will conduct all my philatelic transactions with integrity. etc.
Another thread about removing selvage brought that oath to mind. To me that is an alteration, as is removing the stamps from old covers, etc. Does anyone remember this? How do you feel about altering stamps?
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Altering stamps? I don't even like the idea of HINGING stamps.
I never heard that oath before. Did the US boy scouts have a stamp collecting badge?
Peter
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I have to admit that if I have an imperforate stamp with four sufficiently wide but irregular margins I tend to trim them a bit so that they are at least rectangular. I see no point in keeping a trapezoid just because some Post Office official once wielded inaccurate scissors.
In the UK nice little boys joined the 'Wolf Cubs' before graduating to the Boy Scouts. There was a 'Collector' badge and my 1958 stamp collection, presented to and judged by 'Akela', duly served. When you had five such badges you became a 'Leaping Wolf'. By the time I was 11 I had grown suspicious of uniforms and ritual chants and predator-based nomenclature and left forever. The stamp collection lasted, though.
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Yes the Boy Scouts do have a Stamp Collecting Merit Badge.
Here are the requirements:
Requirements for the Stamp Collecting merit badge:
Do the following:
Discuss how you can better understand people, places, institutions, history, and geography as a result of collecting stamps.
Briefly describe some aspects of the history, growth, and development of the United States postal system. Tell how it is different from postal systems in other countries.
Define topical stamp collecting. Name and describe three other types of stamp collections.
Show at least ONE example of each of the following:
Perforated and imperforate stamps
Mint and used stamps
Sheet, booklet, and coil stamps
Numbers on plate block, booklet, coil, or marginal markings
Overprint and surcharge
Metered mail
Definitive, commemorative, semipostal, and airmail stamps
Cancellation and postmark
First day cover
Postal stationery (aerogramme, stamped envelope, and postal card)
Do the following:
Demonstrate the use of ONE standard catalog for several different stamp issues. Explain why catalog value can vary from the corresponding purchase price.
Explain the meaning of the term condition as used to describe a stamp. Show examples that illustrate the different factors that affect a stamp's value.
Demonstrate the use of at least THREE of the following stamp collector's tools:
Stamp tongs
Water and tray
Magnifiers
Hinges and stamp mounts
Perforation gauge
Glassine envelopes and cover sleeves
Watermark fluid
Do the following:
Show a stamp album and how to mount stamps with or without hinges. Show at least ONE page that displays several stamps.
Discuss at least THREE ways you can help to preserve stamps, covers, and albums in first-class condition.
Do at least TWO of the following:
Design a stamp, cancellation, or cachet.
Visit a post office, stamp club, or stamp show with an experienced collector. Explain what you saw and learned.
Write a review of an interesting article from a stamp newspaper, magazine, book, or web site (with your parent's permission).
Research and report on a famous stamp-related personality or the history behind a particular stamp.
Describe the steps taken to produce a stamp. Include the methods of printing, types of paper, perforation styles, and how they are gummed.
Prepare a two- to three-page display involving stamps. Using ingenuity, as well as clippings, drawings, etc., tell a story about the stamps and how they relate to history, geography, or a favorite topic of yours.
Mount and show, in a purchased or homemade album, ONE of the following:
A collection of 250 or more different stamps from at least 15 countries.
A collection of a stamp from each of 50 different countries, mounted on maps to show the location of each.
A collection of 100 or more different stamps from either one country or a group of closely related countries.
A collection of 75 or more different stamps on a single topic. (Some interesting topics are Scouting, birds, insects, the Olympics, sports, flowers, animals, ships, holidays, trains, famous people, space, and medicine, etc.) Stamps may be from different countries.
A collection of postal items discovered in your mail by monitoring over a period of 30 days. Include at least five different types listed in requirement 3.
_______________________
I haven't found a pledge, yet
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I cringe at the thought of altering a stamp. When I buy or receive a stamp and it has the selvage on it I just can not bring myself to remove it even though it will "not fit" in my album with the selvage on. It just doesn't look right to me. So I have to acquire another stamp.
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When a stamp is placed on an envelope, it is altered. When a stamp is canceled, it is altered. When a stamp is removed from a pane, coil roll, booklet, minisheet, souvenir sheet, etc., it is altered. When someone writes on the back of a stamp, it is altered. No matter what you might say, almost all of us collect altered stamps in the purist meaning of the term.
For the most part, selvedge means nothing. Unless there is a compelling reason to keep the selvedge on, I tear it off so that the stamp fits properly in my album. I have bought collections where stamps with selvedge were mounted all over a page. Selvedge overlaped the stamps in a futile attempt to try to mount the stamps in the correct spaces. Frankly, it looked like crap.
I break souvenir sheets to get the singles if I need them. Souvenir sheets generally are not that popular and can be acquired for much less than the same singles. Saves me some money.
I also will trim the edges of an imperf stamp the same as Guthrum.
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Hi Everyone;
If I pay for a stamp and it is shipped to me, it is mine to do with as I choose.
If I have an imperforate stamp with uneven margins I get out the weed wacker and trim
that fella right straight away. 
If I run out of Zigzags, I roll up a souvenir sheet,
shove in the weed it light her right up. 
AND if I receive stamps that do not meet my strict standards, for defects (pulled perfs, heavy
cancels, thins, stains, heavy creases) they get torn in two, even the duplicates. If I can't
have them, then you can't either, 
so there!
Just driftin' thru....
TuskenRaider
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If anyone is otherwise going to toss out a stamp, please remember the Holocaust Stamp Project. They can accept them damaged.
Their goal is to collect 11 million stamps, one for each victim of the Holocaust. The project has been underway for 6 years, and so far they are about 40% of their way to that goal.
Please read here for more details about the project, why they're doing it, how to donate, and the various mosaics they are creating. There are also links to media coverage, including philatelic publications.
http://www.foxboroughrcs.org/students-families/frcs-holocaust-stamp-project/
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"Yes the Boy Scouts do have a Stamp Collecting Merit Badge.
Here are the requirements:"
The problem was... (as I wanted this Merit Badge while I was in the Scouts). Trying to explain this to your Scoutmaster and asking how to get this badge was practically impossible for me, as he had ZERO appreciation for the hobby whatsoever.
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I tried to get the badge too. I was told that since I was already a stamp collector that I was ineligible to earn the badge. I was told the same for the model railroading badge. I quit the scouts.
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Talking about selvedges....wasn't it K.. that was awarded with envelopes of selvedges from a few friends?
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Yes, Kim was the recipient of a birthday present of several bags of selvage from me and others. I think he had a lot of explaining to do to the better half when all these arrived. I can imagine the look on her face when he opened the envelopes and little pieces of paper fell out.
I typed my selvage (sets, with Scott numbers from the stamps they came from). Most fun in the good old days of SW.
Peter
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Yeah, he was surprised! That was fun.
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I find myself making philatelic oaths whenever I drop my tongs, misplace a stamp or drop a catalog.
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09:17:21pm
Unless there appears to be something of interest about the selvege, to ME, I agree about consigning it to the SS Tidy Bowl.
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Hi Everyone;
We coddle our youth way too much. How are youngsters going to learn anything from stamps
about one of the most evil periods in human history. This is a very lop-sided approach, it is silly.
Show these kids the History Channel B/W videos of the Allies liberation of the death camps,
and the huge piles of bones and skulls. Stop referring to this loss of life as "passing away", they
were murdered, are DEAD, senselessly killed, and burned in ovens. Their gold teeth were ripped
from their dead jaws, their glasses stolen for the melt value of the metal frames, their shoes
taken away and any tiny item of value melted down for the evil greed of the Nazis.
To see the B/W images of living beings with bodies of bare bones like toothpicks, barely able to
stand and walk is an image that needs to be burned indelibly into everyone's brain, young and
old alike. I saw these images and can never forget what was done, including the bomb sites in
Japan after we occupied Japan.
To use a gentle hobby like stamp collecting to teach the results of hatred, evil, and violence,
makes no sense to me, except to give youngsters a very skewed and weird impression of stamp
collectors and stamp collecting!
I'm sorry to all supporters of this well meaning project, if anyone is hurt or upset by my remarks.
If those same supporters donated a few pennies or dollars to this same project, and earmark
those funds for rental or purchase of these videos that would be an effort I myself would be the
first to donate to. My apologies to the moderators and SoR members for going so far off topic.
And not just to single out Germans (I'm German/Irish), what we did by dropping those bombs
was something every American should be required to watch. Little boy was dropped on Hiroshima
on August 6, 1945, followed by a plutonium implosion-type bomb (Fat Man) on the city of
Nagasaki on August 9.
Humans were vaporized until only their skulls were left to be found. And shadows of people
were burned into concrete by the intensity of the flash from these evil bombs. How could stamps
possibly teach a lesson of this horrific event??
Again apologies to all.
Just slinking off with tale between legs....
TuskenRaider
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Ken, I agree that the images of the horror should be etched in the minds of everyone. Yet, there are many who saw the images, and did that teach them anything? Of those people, I'm talking about Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Amin, ISIS, and more, several of whom murdered more people than Hitler did. Barbarians and the worst of scum have no conscious, and they are near to impossible to stop, and when there is a resolve to take action, it usually comes at an enormous price. However, it is a price that has to be paid.
I look at the stamp project to be something to remind everyone of the Holocaust. The symbolism of "broken" stamps to the "broken" lives taken for no reason. The colorful and pretty stamps also serve to memorialize the colorful and pretty lives that were so horrifically taken, and remind us of what humanity lost.
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"I saw these images and can never forget what was done, including the bomb sites in Japan after we occupied Japan."
An don't forget the absolute atrocities the Japanese committed in Pacific islands of Nauru and the Gilbert Islands where native civilians were either massacred or deported to slave camps on other islands.
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Hi Everyone;
Yes BeeSee, you are so right, that the Japanese were very merciless in there treatment of
prisoners and others.
I was once told as a Catholic child in Catholic grade school, that if you are not a Catholic,
getting into Heaven was about as likely as a camel passing thru the eye of a needle! What
a horrible thing to teach a child!! When Christians claim to be teaching love and understanding.
I'm glad the new Pope is trying to get everyone to be more open to people of all faiths.
I've always loved the Amish people, for there love of God, and not trying to convert me.
They will spend an entire day talking about any topic on God or religious views, if I ask.
Otherwise they will talk about anything you bring up in conversation. They never judge
you as long as you do not curse or speak in a vulgar way. They never talk about their religious
views unless you ask them.
If more of us could be like them, we wouldn't have so much hatred and evil, maybe.
Just some thoughts....
TuskenRaider
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Hi All
I'd like to add one to the Philatelist's Oath, as I was a victim of this with one of my posting on StampoRama recently.
If someone lifts the image of a stamp from StampoRama and posts it on another site like Stamp Community Family and does not give credit to the actual owner, well to me this is like stealing credit he does not deserve. He is taking credit for reporting that such and such stamp was discovered, and the actual owner is not given the credit that is due to him!
Perhaps (I hope not) this is a common practice in today's Stamp Collecting Hobby, if so then I'll just have to live with it. But I will call the other person out on it!
That's my two cents worth, would welcome views of others on this.
DAVID THOMPSON
MSGT/USAF/RETIRED
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Hi David;
You are absolutely correct, no person has a right to lift anyone's images. At the very
least, the person posting should be contacted, for permission and acknowledge credit
where credit is due.
This is a hangin' offense on Tatooine....
TuskenRaider
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TuskenRaider
Thank You.
Wish the people who manage StampoRama felt the same way!
Perhaps some day StampoRama could add this to the rules for participation in StampoRama.
Good Luck with future stamps!
DAIVD THOMPSON
MSGT/USAF/RETIRED
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"We coddle our youth way too much. How are youngsters going to learn anything from stamps about one of the most evil periods in human history. This is a very lop-sided approach, it is silly."
And yet, TuskenRaider, it is the approach that I take in my two major collections. I don't presume to comment on the upbringing of American youth, and my collections are not specifically directed at young people, but I can imagine (having been a schoolteacher) using stamps in a study of the Holocaust. I have certainly done so to illustrate other events and personalities of World War Two.
In our schools in the UK the Holocaust is introduced at a young age, when the reaction to certain ideas and events is taken more seriously than, perhaps, it would be when they are three or four years older. I have taught Anne Frank (with stamps!) to eleven year olds in Year 6 at primary school. Of course, you have to be very careful in what you offer and how you put it across. The 'gentle' hobby of stamp collecting does come in handy here.
Young people will find their own way to the horrors, as I did in the years after the Eichmann trial. Eventually they will come to debate Hiroshima and Nagasaki, as they should. I used extracts from John Hersey's Hiroshima in a Japan project some years ago, and, yes, showed a stamp to illustrate the importance with which it is commemorated.
I think stamps can provide a way in to pretty much any subject, however unlikely.
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Hi Guthrum;
I would probably understand and get your collection and come away with an additional view
of these events that I did not get from other sources. The educational system across the pond
here in the states, tends to do nothing that might upset youngsters and very much candy
coats, everything. Sounds like you Brits do a better job of educating youngsters.
I speak mostly of Public schools. Private Catholic schools tend to be a bit more blunt and teach
a bit more towards the truth. Images of which I speak will probably very much upset our youth
and maybe even be too graphic for them. But this is mostly because we here in the states
shelter youngsters way too much.
That's probably why they can't handle bullies very well also. I can remember a time when we
knew how to handle bullies, but that sort of thing is politically incorrect. If you stand up to a
bully from the get go, they will back down and look for a softer target. After all they don't really
want to fight, but just push others around, as it makes them feel important and big shots. If
we had stood up to Hitler sooner, he would not have gotten as far as he did.
Just an opinion....
TuskenRaider
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Tusken, this raises so many interesting points about respective US and UK approaches to education and upbringing, but I fear we are already straying from a strictly stamp-based discussion. I would say, though, that the last part of my career was spent in the private sector, so I would have had more leeway than teachers in the state (US: public) schools regarding choice of history topic and methods used to teach it.
I don't know that you would learn very much from my collections, though you might be surprised to find quite so much material, and interested to see how those countries which commemorate the war have gone about doing so, and which have tended to skim lightly past it.
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Wow this post went all over the place. From the Philatelist's Oath to the holocaust, to teaching people history to people lifting stamp images of others and back to teaching our youth. And somethings about selvage in there somewhere.
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That's the natural rhythm of human conversation - it meanders into all sorts of little side roads.
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This 18 x 24 inch artwork contains 850 stamps.
Each of the eleven figures is filled with stamps from one of the numerous countries occupied by the Nazis during WWII.
A stamp featuring the face of King Christian X forms the head of the figure filled with Danish stamps. There is a popular legend about King Christian X, so well-loved by his countrymen, donning the yellow Star badge, and all Danish citizens following his example, so that the Nazis would be confused about who were the Jews that they were seeking to persecute.
German stamps fill the background, symbolizing the government "behind" the atrocities, while Hitler stamps in the eyes underscore the leadership behind the persecution. The tears are formed with Roosevelt and Churchill stamps...deliberately.
The Star of David, formed with Israeli stamps, foreshadows the establishment of the State of Israel, to which many fled after WWII. Eleanor Roosevelt is honored on one of these stamps.
There are endless learning opportunities embedded in this collection of cancelled postage stamps. It is called "Eleven Million Reasons to Never Forget".
The collage was assembled by fifth grade students who had just been introduced to the impact of a Nazi presence in 1942/43 Denmark, follow-up to their classroom reading of "Number the Stars" by Lois Lowry, which was part of their English class curriculum.
Ten and eleven year olds do not yet have the maturity for much more factual information.
Thank you, Philatarium, Michael78651, and Guthrum for acknowledging the value of SOR members considering donating stamps in any condition to the Holocaust Stamps Project.
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Thanks to csteer's post, I was able to find a larger image of the mosaic she posted. If you'd like to look at it in more detail, follow this link:
http://www.foxboroughrcs.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/collage-2.jpg
Additionally, here's a link to a page that presents other mosaics created in the project.
You can click on the images to see larger versions, and can click on the links to read the stories behind them.
http://www.foxboroughrcs.org/students-families/frcs-holocaust-stamp-project/views-voices-suggested-reading/
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Hi Everyone;
@ csheer;
Hi and thanks for sharing your artwork. The age of your students probably means they
won't see the B/W death camp liberation films. However there are many good B/W films
that they could be mature enough to view.
One in particular comes to my mind, as I'm a big fan of Errol Flynn. That film is
"Edge of Darkness", starring Errol Flynn, Ann Sheridan and Walter Huston.
"Plot
In the Norwegian fishing village of Trollness, residents resist the occupation of
Norway by Nazi Germany. In October 1942, the Norwegian flag is flying high over
the Nazi outpost but almost everyone in town is dead."
There are many good films of the resistance movement, that were made in the 40s & 50s,
that showed the bravery of the allies, and the cowardly actions of the axis powers. But
I believe one of the best films of all time, to show to youngsters is "Red Dawn".
Yes it is a fiction, but shows what happens when the evil enemy comes knocking on your
door of your own home. It stars Patrick Swayze, C. Thomas Howell, Lea Thompson,
Charlie Sheen, and Jennifer Grey. For me it was a very moving film and one which I will
never forget.
May the force be with you....
TuskenRaider
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05:21:26am
" ... And not just to single out Germans (I'm German/Irish), what we did by dropping those bombs was something every American should be required to watch. Little boy was dropped on Hiroshima on August 6, 1945, followed by a plutonium implosion-type bomb (Fat Man) on the city of Nagasaki on August 9.....
I'm sorry to carry this further afield but I feel that this comment implies that the use of those weapons was a bad choice..
First, the projected fatalities of Operation Olympic were estimated to exceed 250,000 and some military leaders feared they could reach a half million. I consider them saved.
I had four uncles on active duty in the Western Pacific who would have been in harms way. Seven of my 36 first cousins were born after WWII, fathered by those uncles. And today, easily twenty of their descendants are alive and enjoying lives, some of whom would have never been born.
Second, the Japanese were known to fight heroically to the death. There were about five hundred thousand military and quasi military on the home islands, perhaps more, and civilians were being trained to defend their homelands from the troops they considered invaders. I suspect to conquer the several islands would have cost most of them their lives and the existence of their descendants as well.
Third, while the deaths and injuries caused by atomic bombs were horrendous in numbers and horrible to experience, I think that they were just a fraction of the lives that were not lost, on both sides due to the almost immediate total surrender.
Then there were the amazingly large numbers of dedicated Japanese troops on the mainland of Asia as well as significant in, Formosa, New Guinea and the Dutch Indies. Conquering the home islands would not mean instant surrender of these forces.
So, I hope we never see or even hear of another atomic bomb being used anywhere, but I can't condemn its use to quickly end the greatest war ever.
If anyone wants to explore this subject further, open a thread in the Non-Philatelic Discussion section and I'll join in.
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Has anyone ever heard the old Boy Scout/ Girl Scout style pledge that used to circulate among stamp collectors? It went something like;
I will take good care of the stamps in my possession. I will not damage or alter them in any way. I will conduct all my philatelic transactions with integrity. etc.
Another thread about removing selvage brought that oath to mind. To me that is an alteration, as is removing the stamps from old covers, etc. Does anyone remember this? How do you feel about altering stamps?
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04:59:44pm
re: The Philatelist's Oath
Altering stamps? I don't even like the idea of HINGING stamps.
I never heard that oath before. Did the US boy scouts have a stamp collecting badge?
Peter
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
I have to admit that if I have an imperforate stamp with four sufficiently wide but irregular margins I tend to trim them a bit so that they are at least rectangular. I see no point in keeping a trapezoid just because some Post Office official once wielded inaccurate scissors.
In the UK nice little boys joined the 'Wolf Cubs' before graduating to the Boy Scouts. There was a 'Collector' badge and my 1958 stamp collection, presented to and judged by 'Akela', duly served. When you had five such badges you became a 'Leaping Wolf'. By the time I was 11 I had grown suspicious of uniforms and ritual chants and predator-based nomenclature and left forever. The stamp collection lasted, though.
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APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
03 Feb 2015
05:49:30pm
Approvals
re: The Philatelist's Oath
Yes the Boy Scouts do have a Stamp Collecting Merit Badge.
Here are the requirements:
Requirements for the Stamp Collecting merit badge:
Do the following:
Discuss how you can better understand people, places, institutions, history, and geography as a result of collecting stamps.
Briefly describe some aspects of the history, growth, and development of the United States postal system. Tell how it is different from postal systems in other countries.
Define topical stamp collecting. Name and describe three other types of stamp collections.
Show at least ONE example of each of the following:
Perforated and imperforate stamps
Mint and used stamps
Sheet, booklet, and coil stamps
Numbers on plate block, booklet, coil, or marginal markings
Overprint and surcharge
Metered mail
Definitive, commemorative, semipostal, and airmail stamps
Cancellation and postmark
First day cover
Postal stationery (aerogramme, stamped envelope, and postal card)
Do the following:
Demonstrate the use of ONE standard catalog for several different stamp issues. Explain why catalog value can vary from the corresponding purchase price.
Explain the meaning of the term condition as used to describe a stamp. Show examples that illustrate the different factors that affect a stamp's value.
Demonstrate the use of at least THREE of the following stamp collector's tools:
Stamp tongs
Water and tray
Magnifiers
Hinges and stamp mounts
Perforation gauge
Glassine envelopes and cover sleeves
Watermark fluid
Do the following:
Show a stamp album and how to mount stamps with or without hinges. Show at least ONE page that displays several stamps.
Discuss at least THREE ways you can help to preserve stamps, covers, and albums in first-class condition.
Do at least TWO of the following:
Design a stamp, cancellation, or cachet.
Visit a post office, stamp club, or stamp show with an experienced collector. Explain what you saw and learned.
Write a review of an interesting article from a stamp newspaper, magazine, book, or web site (with your parent's permission).
Research and report on a famous stamp-related personality or the history behind a particular stamp.
Describe the steps taken to produce a stamp. Include the methods of printing, types of paper, perforation styles, and how they are gummed.
Prepare a two- to three-page display involving stamps. Using ingenuity, as well as clippings, drawings, etc., tell a story about the stamps and how they relate to history, geography, or a favorite topic of yours.
Mount and show, in a purchased or homemade album, ONE of the following:
A collection of 250 or more different stamps from at least 15 countries.
A collection of a stamp from each of 50 different countries, mounted on maps to show the location of each.
A collection of 100 or more different stamps from either one country or a group of closely related countries.
A collection of 75 or more different stamps on a single topic. (Some interesting topics are Scouting, birds, insects, the Olympics, sports, flowers, animals, ships, holidays, trains, famous people, space, and medicine, etc.) Stamps may be from different countries.
A collection of postal items discovered in your mail by monitoring over a period of 30 days. Include at least five different types listed in requirement 3.
_______________________
I haven't found a pledge, yet
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06:05:33pm
re: The Philatelist's Oath
I cringe at the thought of altering a stamp. When I buy or receive a stamp and it has the selvage on it I just can not bring myself to remove it even though it will "not fit" in my album with the selvage on. It just doesn't look right to me. So I have to acquire another stamp.
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08:46:20pm
re: The Philatelist's Oath
When a stamp is placed on an envelope, it is altered. When a stamp is canceled, it is altered. When a stamp is removed from a pane, coil roll, booklet, minisheet, souvenir sheet, etc., it is altered. When someone writes on the back of a stamp, it is altered. No matter what you might say, almost all of us collect altered stamps in the purist meaning of the term.
For the most part, selvedge means nothing. Unless there is a compelling reason to keep the selvedge on, I tear it off so that the stamp fits properly in my album. I have bought collections where stamps with selvedge were mounted all over a page. Selvedge overlaped the stamps in a futile attempt to try to mount the stamps in the correct spaces. Frankly, it looked like crap.
I break souvenir sheets to get the singles if I need them. Souvenir sheets generally are not that popular and can be acquired for much less than the same singles. Saves me some money.
I also will trim the edges of an imperf stamp the same as Guthrum.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Hi Everyone;
If I pay for a stamp and it is shipped to me, it is mine to do with as I choose.
If I have an imperforate stamp with uneven margins I get out the weed wacker and trim
that fella right straight away. If I run out of Zigzags, I roll up a souvenir sheet,
shove in the weed it light her right up.
AND if I receive stamps that do not meet my strict standards, for defects (pulled perfs, heavy
cancels, thins, stains, heavy creases) they get torn in two, even the duplicates. If I can't
have them, then you can't either, so there!
Just driftin' thru....
TuskenRaider
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
If anyone is otherwise going to toss out a stamp, please remember the Holocaust Stamp Project. They can accept them damaged.
Their goal is to collect 11 million stamps, one for each victim of the Holocaust. The project has been underway for 6 years, and so far they are about 40% of their way to that goal.
Please read here for more details about the project, why they're doing it, how to donate, and the various mosaics they are creating. There are also links to media coverage, including philatelic publications.
http://www.foxboroughrcs.org/students-families/frcs-holocaust-stamp-project/
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
"Yes the Boy Scouts do have a Stamp Collecting Merit Badge.
Here are the requirements:"
The problem was... (as I wanted this Merit Badge while I was in the Scouts). Trying to explain this to your Scoutmaster and asking how to get this badge was practically impossible for me, as he had ZERO appreciation for the hobby whatsoever.
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10:09:14am
re: The Philatelist's Oath
I tried to get the badge too. I was told that since I was already a stamp collector that I was ineligible to earn the badge. I was told the same for the model railroading badge. I quit the scouts.
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APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
04 Feb 2015
04:05:39pm
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Talking about selvedges....wasn't it K.. that was awarded with envelopes of selvedges from a few friends?
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05:10:10pm
re: The Philatelist's Oath
Yes, Kim was the recipient of a birthday present of several bags of selvage from me and others. I think he had a lot of explaining to do to the better half when all these arrived. I can imagine the look on her face when he opened the envelopes and little pieces of paper fell out.
I typed my selvage (sets, with Scott numbers from the stamps they came from). Most fun in the good old days of SW.
Peter
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05:49:07pm
re: The Philatelist's Oath
Yeah, he was surprised! That was fun.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
I find myself making philatelic oaths whenever I drop my tongs, misplace a stamp or drop a catalog.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
04 Feb 2015
09:17:21pm
re: The Philatelist's Oath
Unless there appears to be something of interest about the selvege, to ME, I agree about consigning it to the SS Tidy Bowl.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Hi Everyone;
We coddle our youth way too much. How are youngsters going to learn anything from stamps
about one of the most evil periods in human history. This is a very lop-sided approach, it is silly.
Show these kids the History Channel B/W videos of the Allies liberation of the death camps,
and the huge piles of bones and skulls. Stop referring to this loss of life as "passing away", they
were murdered, are DEAD, senselessly killed, and burned in ovens. Their gold teeth were ripped
from their dead jaws, their glasses stolen for the melt value of the metal frames, their shoes
taken away and any tiny item of value melted down for the evil greed of the Nazis.
To see the B/W images of living beings with bodies of bare bones like toothpicks, barely able to
stand and walk is an image that needs to be burned indelibly into everyone's brain, young and
old alike. I saw these images and can never forget what was done, including the bomb sites in
Japan after we occupied Japan.
To use a gentle hobby like stamp collecting to teach the results of hatred, evil, and violence,
makes no sense to me, except to give youngsters a very skewed and weird impression of stamp
collectors and stamp collecting!
I'm sorry to all supporters of this well meaning project, if anyone is hurt or upset by my remarks.
If those same supporters donated a few pennies or dollars to this same project, and earmark
those funds for rental or purchase of these videos that would be an effort I myself would be the
first to donate to. My apologies to the moderators and SoR members for going so far off topic.
And not just to single out Germans (I'm German/Irish), what we did by dropping those bombs
was something every American should be required to watch. Little boy was dropped on Hiroshima
on August 6, 1945, followed by a plutonium implosion-type bomb (Fat Man) on the city of
Nagasaki on August 9.
Humans were vaporized until only their skulls were left to be found. And shadows of people
were burned into concrete by the intensity of the flash from these evil bombs. How could stamps
possibly teach a lesson of this horrific event??
Again apologies to all.
Just slinking off with tale between legs....
TuskenRaider
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10:04:33pm
re: The Philatelist's Oath
Ken, I agree that the images of the horror should be etched in the minds of everyone. Yet, there are many who saw the images, and did that teach them anything? Of those people, I'm talking about Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Amin, ISIS, and more, several of whom murdered more people than Hitler did. Barbarians and the worst of scum have no conscious, and they are near to impossible to stop, and when there is a resolve to take action, it usually comes at an enormous price. However, it is a price that has to be paid.
I look at the stamp project to be something to remind everyone of the Holocaust. The symbolism of "broken" stamps to the "broken" lives taken for no reason. The colorful and pretty stamps also serve to memorialize the colorful and pretty lives that were so horrifically taken, and remind us of what humanity lost.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
"I saw these images and can never forget what was done, including the bomb sites in Japan after we occupied Japan."
An don't forget the absolute atrocities the Japanese committed in Pacific islands of Nauru and the Gilbert Islands where native civilians were either massacred or deported to slave camps on other islands.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Hi Everyone;
Yes BeeSee, you are so right, that the Japanese were very merciless in there treatment of
prisoners and others.
I was once told as a Catholic child in Catholic grade school, that if you are not a Catholic,
getting into Heaven was about as likely as a camel passing thru the eye of a needle! What
a horrible thing to teach a child!! When Christians claim to be teaching love and understanding.
I'm glad the new Pope is trying to get everyone to be more open to people of all faiths.
I've always loved the Amish people, for there love of God, and not trying to convert me.
They will spend an entire day talking about any topic on God or religious views, if I ask.
Otherwise they will talk about anything you bring up in conversation. They never judge
you as long as you do not curse or speak in a vulgar way. They never talk about their religious
views unless you ask them.
If more of us could be like them, we wouldn't have so much hatred and evil, maybe.
Just some thoughts....
TuskenRaider
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01:04:01am
re: The Philatelist's Oath
Hi All
I'd like to add one to the Philatelist's Oath, as I was a victim of this with one of my posting on StampoRama recently.
If someone lifts the image of a stamp from StampoRama and posts it on another site like Stamp Community Family and does not give credit to the actual owner, well to me this is like stealing credit he does not deserve. He is taking credit for reporting that such and such stamp was discovered, and the actual owner is not given the credit that is due to him!
Perhaps (I hope not) this is a common practice in today's Stamp Collecting Hobby, if so then I'll just have to live with it. But I will call the other person out on it!
That's my two cents worth, would welcome views of others on this.
DAVID THOMPSON
MSGT/USAF/RETIRED
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Hi David;
You are absolutely correct, no person has a right to lift anyone's images. At the very
least, the person posting should be contacted, for permission and acknowledge credit
where credit is due.
This is a hangin' offense on Tatooine....
TuskenRaider
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01:49:47am
re: The Philatelist's Oath
TuskenRaider
Thank You.
Wish the people who manage StampoRama felt the same way!
Perhaps some day StampoRama could add this to the rules for participation in StampoRama.
Good Luck with future stamps!
DAIVD THOMPSON
MSGT/USAF/RETIRED
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
"We coddle our youth way too much. How are youngsters going to learn anything from stamps about one of the most evil periods in human history. This is a very lop-sided approach, it is silly."
And yet, TuskenRaider, it is the approach that I take in my two major collections. I don't presume to comment on the upbringing of American youth, and my collections are not specifically directed at young people, but I can imagine (having been a schoolteacher) using stamps in a study of the Holocaust. I have certainly done so to illustrate other events and personalities of World War Two.
In our schools in the UK the Holocaust is introduced at a young age, when the reaction to certain ideas and events is taken more seriously than, perhaps, it would be when they are three or four years older. I have taught Anne Frank (with stamps!) to eleven year olds in Year 6 at primary school. Of course, you have to be very careful in what you offer and how you put it across. The 'gentle' hobby of stamp collecting does come in handy here.
Young people will find their own way to the horrors, as I did in the years after the Eichmann trial. Eventually they will come to debate Hiroshima and Nagasaki, as they should. I used extracts from John Hersey's Hiroshima in a Japan project some years ago, and, yes, showed a stamp to illustrate the importance with which it is commemorated.
I think stamps can provide a way in to pretty much any subject, however unlikely.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Hi Guthrum;
I would probably understand and get your collection and come away with an additional view
of these events that I did not get from other sources. The educational system across the pond
here in the states, tends to do nothing that might upset youngsters and very much candy
coats, everything. Sounds like you Brits do a better job of educating youngsters.
I speak mostly of Public schools. Private Catholic schools tend to be a bit more blunt and teach
a bit more towards the truth. Images of which I speak will probably very much upset our youth
and maybe even be too graphic for them. But this is mostly because we here in the states
shelter youngsters way too much.
That's probably why they can't handle bullies very well also. I can remember a time when we
knew how to handle bullies, but that sort of thing is politically incorrect. If you stand up to a
bully from the get go, they will back down and look for a softer target. After all they don't really
want to fight, but just push others around, as it makes them feel important and big shots. If
we had stood up to Hitler sooner, he would not have gotten as far as he did.
Just an opinion....
TuskenRaider
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Tusken, this raises so many interesting points about respective US and UK approaches to education and upbringing, but I fear we are already straying from a strictly stamp-based discussion. I would say, though, that the last part of my career was spent in the private sector, so I would have had more leeway than teachers in the state (US: public) schools regarding choice of history topic and methods used to teach it.
I don't know that you would learn very much from my collections, though you might be surprised to find quite so much material, and interested to see how those countries which commemorate the war have gone about doing so, and which have tended to skim lightly past it.
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01:05:28pm
re: The Philatelist's Oath
Wow this post went all over the place. From the Philatelist's Oath to the holocaust, to teaching people history to people lifting stamp images of others and back to teaching our youth. And somethings about selvage in there somewhere.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
That's the natural rhythm of human conversation - it meanders into all sorts of little side roads.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
This 18 x 24 inch artwork contains 850 stamps.
Each of the eleven figures is filled with stamps from one of the numerous countries occupied by the Nazis during WWII.
A stamp featuring the face of King Christian X forms the head of the figure filled with Danish stamps. There is a popular legend about King Christian X, so well-loved by his countrymen, donning the yellow Star badge, and all Danish citizens following his example, so that the Nazis would be confused about who were the Jews that they were seeking to persecute.
German stamps fill the background, symbolizing the government "behind" the atrocities, while Hitler stamps in the eyes underscore the leadership behind the persecution. The tears are formed with Roosevelt and Churchill stamps...deliberately.
The Star of David, formed with Israeli stamps, foreshadows the establishment of the State of Israel, to which many fled after WWII. Eleanor Roosevelt is honored on one of these stamps.
There are endless learning opportunities embedded in this collection of cancelled postage stamps. It is called "Eleven Million Reasons to Never Forget".
The collage was assembled by fifth grade students who had just been introduced to the impact of a Nazi presence in 1942/43 Denmark, follow-up to their classroom reading of "Number the Stars" by Lois Lowry, which was part of their English class curriculum.
Ten and eleven year olds do not yet have the maturity for much more factual information.
Thank you, Philatarium, Michael78651, and Guthrum for acknowledging the value of SOR members considering donating stamps in any condition to the Holocaust Stamps Project.
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Thanks to csteer's post, I was able to find a larger image of the mosaic she posted. If you'd like to look at it in more detail, follow this link:
http://www.foxboroughrcs.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/collage-2.jpg
Additionally, here's a link to a page that presents other mosaics created in the project.
You can click on the images to see larger versions, and can click on the links to read the stories behind them.
http://www.foxboroughrcs.org/students-families/frcs-holocaust-stamp-project/views-voices-suggested-reading/
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re: The Philatelist's Oath
Hi Everyone;
@ csheer;
Hi and thanks for sharing your artwork. The age of your students probably means they
won't see the B/W death camp liberation films. However there are many good B/W films
that they could be mature enough to view.
One in particular comes to my mind, as I'm a big fan of Errol Flynn. That film is
"Edge of Darkness", starring Errol Flynn, Ann Sheridan and Walter Huston.
"Plot
In the Norwegian fishing village of Trollness, residents resist the occupation of
Norway by Nazi Germany. In October 1942, the Norwegian flag is flying high over
the Nazi outpost but almost everyone in town is dead."
There are many good films of the resistance movement, that were made in the 40s & 50s,
that showed the bravery of the allies, and the cowardly actions of the axis powers. But
I believe one of the best films of all time, to show to youngsters is "Red Dawn".
Yes it is a fiction, but shows what happens when the evil enemy comes knocking on your
door of your own home. It stars Patrick Swayze, C. Thomas Howell, Lea Thompson,
Charlie Sheen, and Jennifer Grey. For me it was a very moving film and one which I will
never forget.
May the force be with you....
TuskenRaider
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
06 Feb 2015
05:21:26am
re: The Philatelist's Oath
" ... And not just to single out Germans (I'm German/Irish), what we did by dropping those bombs was something every American should be required to watch. Little boy was dropped on Hiroshima on August 6, 1945, followed by a plutonium implosion-type bomb (Fat Man) on the city of Nagasaki on August 9.....
I'm sorry to carry this further afield but I feel that this comment implies that the use of those weapons was a bad choice..
First, the projected fatalities of Operation Olympic were estimated to exceed 250,000 and some military leaders feared they could reach a half million. I consider them saved.
I had four uncles on active duty in the Western Pacific who would have been in harms way. Seven of my 36 first cousins were born after WWII, fathered by those uncles. And today, easily twenty of their descendants are alive and enjoying lives, some of whom would have never been born.
Second, the Japanese were known to fight heroically to the death. There were about five hundred thousand military and quasi military on the home islands, perhaps more, and civilians were being trained to defend their homelands from the troops they considered invaders. I suspect to conquer the several islands would have cost most of them their lives and the existence of their descendants as well.
Third, while the deaths and injuries caused by atomic bombs were horrendous in numbers and horrible to experience, I think that they were just a fraction of the lives that were not lost, on both sides due to the almost immediate total surrender.
Then there were the amazingly large numbers of dedicated Japanese troops on the mainland of Asia as well as significant in, Formosa, New Guinea and the Dutch Indies. Conquering the home islands would not mean instant surrender of these forces.
So, I hope we never see or even hear of another atomic bomb being used anywhere, but I can't condemn its use to quickly end the greatest war ever.
If anyone wants to explore this subject further, open a thread in the Non-Philatelic Discussion section and I'll join in.
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