Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Came across this stamp and would like some information. Other than the obvious!
The stamp on the left is the correct one, Scott #127. The stamp on the right has the omission of red.
Your thoughts about this one?
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My thoughts? Awesome!
I don't find it listed in any of my resources.
I like it!
WB
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Thanks. It's one I'm having investigated.
I was referred to search for someone that has a Bale Catalog. Anyone happen to have one in their library?
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Thanks bulldog. But I sure would like more information about this error.
Another friend has asked a contact to check in Bale and he found no mention of this error, but that was from an older book.
Another friend has asked a contact at SIP for help and they haven't replied yet.
I was hoping somebody here could help me. I'm more curious as each day goes by and nothing can be found about it.
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I would do some testing on the normal one (water, alcohol, lighter fluid, Goo-Gone, etc) to see if the red ink might have been chemically removed.
Ted
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I just checked the Scott Catalog. There is a note saying (and I quote), "Any copy of #127 with red color missing is a fake and should just as well be forwarded to a Michigan sports fan." (Well, that's what it says in MY catalog.
)
Ted
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Well both are watermarked. So I could test with lighter fluid and see what happens.
Oh my goodness, Ted you are a hoot! I almost fell for it and re-read my catalog! Too funny, you got me! almost
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Would I lie to you?
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Well I'll be, there it is ... so what's the address? 
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You can pm ME, for Ted's address. I'll be sure you get the right one.
WB
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sure you will and I'll also add the bill for that bridge in Brooklyn! 
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Dang, I just knew that was gonna work! Oh well.
I really hope your stamp works out to be a prize! There couldn't have been many put into circulation.
LondonBus1 would be the first person I'd check with.
WB
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Yes, I have Doe and LB1 and several different philately groups hunting information for me. Somewhere someone will recognize this and lend me some of their knowledge.
In the meantime, if anybody has any suggestions, I'm open to any thing.
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This is so exciting! What a find, Luree!
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"I just checked the Scott Catalog. There is a note saying (and I quote), "Any copy of #127 with red color missing is a fake and should just as well be forwarded to a Michigan sports fan." "
Oh good, that will work out well for me!
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This would be really neat if it is a missing colour bit it doesn't look right to me. 
At first sight the red text across the top is missing but if you look carefully it is still there but in the wrong colour - the same wrong colour as where the other red areas should be.
It's possible the red text was printed in red on yellow and simply the red is missing but I wee no reason for this and believe the red has faded out so we have a colour changeling.
However, I'me very happy to be proved wrong. 
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This is the best enhancement my armchair forensic skills could muster.
I would think that a color changeling would maintain distinctly formed characters at the top. Because of the blurring of the characters, and the mottled appearance of the lamp and the museum along with the smearing at the right edge outside the museum wall, I'm staying with the chemical wash hypothesis.
Ted
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Hi Ted,
I had missed your note above. Yes, I agree that something has happened to the red ink. I would consider a chemical change to result in a form of "changeling".
My main point was that it doesn't appear to me to be a missing colour.
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"
"Bale lists the red omitted mint tab stamp at $220. Your looks like used no tab red omitted stamp, so would not catalogue any where near this so I would guess a cat value of $50-100 with a cash value of $15-$30.A normal used no tab has a bale cat value of $ 0.20. The ultimate value is of course what someone would offer for the stamp!""
Oh, yeah. That's what I meant to say.
Lying Ted
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Thanks for all the input. This is why I love this site!
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Ha ha Ted!
I think your own analysis is pretty safe.
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Please note that the above quote was from me and was placed on the Levant Philately study group board...many thanks for the Acknowledgement.
This is my comments in full:
There are a lot of errors of Israel stamps which I have come across over the years. For example Mosden's 1958 catalogue has 18 pages of errors. Most of these are "Fly Spec" errors eg 5mils Dor Ivri has chain variety, eve flaw, flaw above aleph ,flaw above reish, yod obliterated,etc etc and one of the most famous of the early issues is wrong descriptive tabs of the 10/15mils values, where the tab inscriptions are reversed.
Later issues have errors in phosphors especially the definitive issues, but also on a few commemerative issues.Another key set is the 12 tribes issue of 1955-56 which has a later printing when 7 of the values have no watermark.
The stamp at the start of this thread is the 1957 50th Anniversary of Bezalel Museum stamp.Bale lists the red omitted mint tab stamp at $220. Your looks like used no tab red omitted stamp, so would not catalogue any where near this so I would guess a cat value of $50-100 with a cash value of $15-$30.A normal used no tab has a bale cat value of $ 0.20. The ultimate value is of course what someone would offer for the stamp!
Has anyone bought or sold one of these stamps...if so how much ?
(Moderator Note: Bad link removed.)
(Modified by Moderator on 2017-09-06 12:14:56)
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I have a similar issue with the Eilat Camel stamp and have just posted on Levant board:
I have a shade variety of the 1950 Negev Camel stamp, bale 47, scott 25 which is used, no tab, light brown compared to the normal dark brown. I have been told by various dealers and experts in Israel that the sun has bleached this stamp, but I disagree as the colour is even and the condition is good. It is not listed anywhere in my books as having shades. It is only listed in Bale as having forged postmarks, usually as a FDC.Mosden in 1958 comments about minor plate varieties ,but no shades.I saw a similar shade to mine sell on ebay for about $20-$25 about 18 months/2 years ago.
Anyone checked the colour of this stamp? Or found a book that lists it?
I believe that in the early days of Israel,supplies of printing materials were not always readily available and that this resulted in some of the errors in the early stamps.
(Moderator Note: Bad link removed.)
(Modified by Moderator on 2017-09-06 12:15:21)
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APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
28 Mar 2016
06:38:07pm
Hi all,
Came across this stamp and would like some information. Other than the obvious!
The stamp on the left is the correct one, Scott #127. The stamp on the right has the omission of red.
Your thoughts about this one?
2 Members
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re: Israel EFO
My thoughts? Awesome!
I don't find it listed in any of my resources.
I like it!
WB
Login to Like
this post
APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
29 Mar 2016
05:29:12am
re: Israel EFO
Thanks. It's one I'm having investigated.
I was referred to search for someone that has a Bale Catalog. Anyone happen to have one in their library?
Login to Like
this post
APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
29 Mar 2016
03:47:15pm
re: Israel EFO
Thanks bulldog. But I sure would like more information about this error.
Another friend has asked a contact to check in Bale and he found no mention of this error, but that was from an older book.
Another friend has asked a contact at SIP for help and they haven't replied yet.
I was hoping somebody here could help me. I'm more curious as each day goes by and nothing can be found about it.
Login to Like
this post
re: Israel EFO
I would do some testing on the normal one (water, alcohol, lighter fluid, Goo-Gone, etc) to see if the red ink might have been chemically removed.
Ted
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this post
re: Israel EFO
I just checked the Scott Catalog. There is a note saying (and I quote), "Any copy of #127 with red color missing is a fake and should just as well be forwarded to a Michigan sports fan." (Well, that's what it says in MY catalog.)
Ted
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APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
29 Mar 2016
04:08:27pm
re: Israel EFO
Well both are watermarked. So I could test with lighter fluid and see what happens.
Oh my goodness, Ted you are a hoot! I almost fell for it and re-read my catalog! Too funny, you got me! almost
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re: Israel EFO
Would I lie to you?
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APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
29 Mar 2016
04:19:45pm
re: Israel EFO
Well I'll be, there it is ... so what's the address?
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re: Israel EFO
You can pm ME, for Ted's address. I'll be sure you get the right one.
WB
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APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
29 Mar 2016
07:56:44pm
re: Israel EFO
sure you will and I'll also add the bill for that bridge in Brooklyn!
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re: Israel EFO
Dang, I just knew that was gonna work! Oh well.
I really hope your stamp works out to be a prize! There couldn't have been many put into circulation.
LondonBus1 would be the first person I'd check with.
WB
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APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
29 Mar 2016
08:10:30pm
re: Israel EFO
Yes, I have Doe and LB1 and several different philately groups hunting information for me. Somewhere someone will recognize this and lend me some of their knowledge.
In the meantime, if anybody has any suggestions, I'm open to any thing.
Login to Like
this post
re: Israel EFO
This is so exciting! What a find, Luree!
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: Israel EFO
"I just checked the Scott Catalog. There is a note saying (and I quote), "Any copy of #127 with red color missing is a fake and should just as well be forwarded to a Michigan sports fan." "
Oh good, that will work out well for me!
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: Israel EFO
This would be really neat if it is a missing colour bit it doesn't look right to me.
At first sight the red text across the top is missing but if you look carefully it is still there but in the wrong colour - the same wrong colour as where the other red areas should be.
It's possible the red text was printed in red on yellow and simply the red is missing but I wee no reason for this and believe the red has faded out so we have a colour changeling.
However, I'me very happy to be proved wrong.
Login to Like
this post
re: Israel EFO
This is the best enhancement my armchair forensic skills could muster.
I would think that a color changeling would maintain distinctly formed characters at the top. Because of the blurring of the characters, and the mottled appearance of the lamp and the museum along with the smearing at the right edge outside the museum wall, I'm staying with the chemical wash hypothesis.
Ted
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this post
re: Israel EFO
Hi Ted,
I had missed your note above. Yes, I agree that something has happened to the red ink. I would consider a chemical change to result in a form of "changeling".
My main point was that it doesn't appear to me to be a missing colour.
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re: Israel EFO
"
"Bale lists the red omitted mint tab stamp at $220. Your looks like used no tab red omitted stamp, so would not catalogue any where near this so I would guess a cat value of $50-100 with a cash value of $15-$30.A normal used no tab has a bale cat value of $ 0.20. The ultimate value is of course what someone would offer for the stamp!""
Oh, yeah. That's what I meant to say.
Lying Ted
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APS #222602 and Internet Philatelic Dealers Association #439
31 Mar 2016
06:28:23am
re: Israel EFO
Thanks for all the input. This is why I love this site!
Login to Like
this post
re: Israel EFO
Ha ha Ted!
I think your own analysis is pretty safe.
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: Israel EFO
Please note that the above quote was from me and was placed on the Levant Philately study group board...many thanks for the Acknowledgement.
This is my comments in full:
There are a lot of errors of Israel stamps which I have come across over the years. For example Mosden's 1958 catalogue has 18 pages of errors. Most of these are "Fly Spec" errors eg 5mils Dor Ivri has chain variety, eve flaw, flaw above aleph ,flaw above reish, yod obliterated,etc etc and one of the most famous of the early issues is wrong descriptive tabs of the 10/15mils values, where the tab inscriptions are reversed.
Later issues have errors in phosphors especially the definitive issues, but also on a few commemerative issues.Another key set is the 12 tribes issue of 1955-56 which has a later printing when 7 of the values have no watermark.
The stamp at the start of this thread is the 1957 50th Anniversary of Bezalel Museum stamp.Bale lists the red omitted mint tab stamp at $220. Your looks like used no tab red omitted stamp, so would not catalogue any where near this so I would guess a cat value of $50-100 with a cash value of $15-$30.A normal used no tab has a bale cat value of $ 0.20. The ultimate value is of course what someone would offer for the stamp!
Has anyone bought or sold one of these stamps...if so how much ?
(Moderator Note: Bad link removed.)
(Modified by Moderator on 2017-09-06 12:14:56)
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this post
re: Israel EFO
I have a similar issue with the Eilat Camel stamp and have just posted on Levant board:
I have a shade variety of the 1950 Negev Camel stamp, bale 47, scott 25 which is used, no tab, light brown compared to the normal dark brown. I have been told by various dealers and experts in Israel that the sun has bleached this stamp, but I disagree as the colour is even and the condition is good. It is not listed anywhere in my books as having shades. It is only listed in Bale as having forged postmarks, usually as a FDC.Mosden in 1958 comments about minor plate varieties ,but no shades.I saw a similar shade to mine sell on ebay for about $20-$25 about 18 months/2 years ago.
Anyone checked the colour of this stamp? Or found a book that lists it?
I believe that in the early days of Israel,supplies of printing materials were not always readily available and that this resulted in some of the errors in the early stamps.
(Moderator Note: Bad link removed.)
(Modified by Moderator on 2017-09-06 12:15:21)
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