Hello mbo1142,
Did you read one of my posts earlier?
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=24149#171232
The second picture has a blue cross from a pencil.
Have you looked very closely on the front of the stamp? Is it really not used in any kind of way like my example in the above link?
If not than the signature on the back is on the wrong side of the stamp and most likely FALSCH / FORGED
Cancelled stamps are ALWAYS signed on the right side
MNH stamps ALWAYS on the left side of the stamp.
See my other post on this forum :
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=23169#171068
I do not recognize this sign on the back of the stamp too.
If you really want some information on this stamp goto the folowwing link :
http://stampforgeries.com/forged-stamps-of-theresienstadt/
Morning HockeyNut,
I have read all your post and find them most informative and interesting. I looked at your post about the second picture and do not see any blue cross with pencil. I see the star, but is printed on the paper just like the other two pictures.
I fully understand the placement of expert marks on the back of stamps, but my question is when did the formal placement start? Could an expert mark have been placed prior to the time the placement positions were formalized?
I did fully research the stamp and did use the web site you mentioned. My stamp meets all the criteria, specifically all 6 points indicated in the picture of a real stamp. I also used the following:
https://www.filatelia.fi/experts/namesa.html
https://www.fritzwagner.com/helgoland/Hel_JvS/helgoland_proofer_signatures.htm
http://stampforgeries.com/forged-stamps-of-theresienstadt/
https://www.stampsx.com/ratgeber/ratgeber-theresienstadt.php
As mentioned in my post, I am by no means an expert. That is why I will be sending for certification. Some times I get lucky.
Thank you for your interest.
Mel
Hello Mel,
As I write this it is 16:00 hours here. I think it is still morning overthere??
Well if you checked out all those points and there all oke.
And about the blue cross. I have darkend the picture and now he looks like this :
See the blue cross now?
Well futhermore I wish you luck with the certification.
Yes, it is still morning here. Just went on daylight saving time and it is now 10:31. I must apologize, I only looked at the last picture you posted. Went back to the beginning and I do see the blue cross you mention. I cannot find any mark on the front of the stamp and that, along with the position of the mark on the back is the only thing that has me concerned.
Before I send for certification, do you have any recommendations on where to send? I plan to send to BPP, but would like to use someone in the US to save on cost.
Regards, Mel
Phuh, recommendations.......
Well BPP ofcourse but then you have to send it to Germany.
But before you go into that read the following carefully.....
https://www.bpp.de/en/expertising-rules/
More on the menu ABOUT US.
I do not know if there are BPP certified people in the States.
I took a quick peek and saw only : Germany, Austria, Sweden, Switzerland
Expertiser GILBERT died a couple of years ago and I believe PÄTOW (or PAETOW without the A umlaut) too.
Expertiser of BOHMEN UND MAHREN is now-a-days Mister DETLEF PFEIFFER.
WOW! Just read the BPP rules from the link you posted. Very informative and precise. I have already sent an email to Mr. DETLEF PFEIFFER asking for his address and price. Found his email address on one of the Web sites I researched.
I also sent an email to the German Philatelic Society here in the US asking if they knew of anyone in the states that would be suitable for expertising the stamp.
Will let you know if I get any responses.
Best Wishes, Mel
PS: Thought I had already sent this response, but must have hit the wrong button. If a duplicate, I apologize.
Glad to help.
Detlef Pfeiffer
Marksuhler Ring 9
71126 Gäufelden-Öschelbronn
Deutschland
pfeiffer-detlef@t-online.de
Expert areas
Bohemia and Moravia
Generalgouvernement
Mährisch-Ostrau Michel Nos. 1 – 63
Presume these apply to the genuine stamp and not the forgery.
Can you tell me where you found the information you just posted regarding the stamp. I want to add it to my bookmarks for future reference.
Thanks,
Mel
@mbo1142
one of my 150+ articles on WW forgeries (+1700 pages for now) - a 5 page article
I occasionally publish some on another site & will/might eventually publish a book
No website or blog access - too busy to maintain
Mel,
I told you in the previous post,
"If you really want some information on this stamp goto the folowwing link :
http://stampforgeries.com/forged-stamps-of-theresienstadt/
"
I have already been to that site and have it bookmarked. In fact that is where I got most of my information regarding the stamp I have and where I found the information regarding Mr. Detlef Pfeiffer. That site only shows 6 items to look for. The picture posted by SForgCa shows 8 different items to look for and for the reason I was looking to add an additional source.
My stamp is on its way to Mr. Detlef Pfeiffer and when it returns, I will post here.
Mel
"HockeyNut -I even guess that the link I gave you is HIS site."
Keeping my fingers crossed!!!
GUESS WHAT CAME IN THE MAIL TODAY, 2 1/2 MONTHS AFTER MAILING FROM GERMANY!!!!!
I am no a happy camper.
Mel
Mel.
After waiting so long for the certificate I was surprised to read your comment, "I am no a happy camper". Very sorry to hear you are disappointed, so being the friend I am ... I will take the stamp off your hands.
Meanwhile, I'll keep my fingers crossed this was just bad grammar caused by months of isolation, not a bad typo or a stuck "w" key...
Dave.
Dave,
Nice try. I was so excited that I did not even spel check
Mel
Congratulations Mel.
Great piece to have and now certified too.
Received in the mail today an unused Theresienstadt Parcel Admission Stamp as shown below.
The stamp depicts the surrounding landscape of Bohemia. The camp was established by the Germans in November 1941 about 40 miles north of Prague in the Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia created after Nazi Germany occupied the western region of Czechoslovakia in March 1939. It was a multi-use camp, acting as a settlement, transit camp, and propaganda tool. The stamp, which was printed in Prague, was issued by the Prague Jewish Council beginning in July 1943. Inmates at Theresienstadt could receive inspected packages of food and clothing from people outside the camp if the packages had this stamp. An inmate could request a package every two months. The Jewish Council in Prague would notify the sender to come pick up the stamp if they lived in Prague, if they lived outside of Prague, the stamp would be attached to the notice. Living conditions in the camp were horrible and about 33,000 inmates died there. On May 2, 1945, as the end of the war approached, the International Red Cross took over administration of the camp. The German staff fled on May 5 and 6, and on May 9. Soviet troops arrived and assumed responsibility.
This stamp is very often faked. Some are so good that even the fakes are faked. In addition signatures on the back are also often faked. I am by no means and expert, but I researched this stamp over a 3 month period. I had the seller send me a full screen 600 DPI picture so that I could make out the details that separate the fakes from the real item. I cannot make out the signature on the back, nor could the seller. After receiving the stamp, I studied under my microscope to look for any signs that would cause me concern and found none. I am fairly confident that the stamp is genuine, but will be sending to the BPP for authentication.
Although not listed in Scotts, it is listed in Michel and completes my collection of German Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia 1939-1945.
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Hello mbo1142,
Did you read one of my posts earlier?
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=24149#171232
The second picture has a blue cross from a pencil.
Have you looked very closely on the front of the stamp? Is it really not used in any kind of way like my example in the above link?
If not than the signature on the back is on the wrong side of the stamp and most likely FALSCH / FORGED
Cancelled stamps are ALWAYS signed on the right side
MNH stamps ALWAYS on the left side of the stamp.
See my other post on this forum :
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=23169#171068
I do not recognize this sign on the back of the stamp too.
If you really want some information on this stamp goto the folowwing link :
http://stampforgeries.com/forged-stamps-of-theresienstadt/
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Morning HockeyNut,
I have read all your post and find them most informative and interesting. I looked at your post about the second picture and do not see any blue cross with pencil. I see the star, but is printed on the paper just like the other two pictures.
I fully understand the placement of expert marks on the back of stamps, but my question is when did the formal placement start? Could an expert mark have been placed prior to the time the placement positions were formalized?
I did fully research the stamp and did use the web site you mentioned. My stamp meets all the criteria, specifically all 6 points indicated in the picture of a real stamp. I also used the following:
https://www.filatelia.fi/experts/namesa.html
https://www.fritzwagner.com/helgoland/Hel_JvS/helgoland_proofer_signatures.htm
http://stampforgeries.com/forged-stamps-of-theresienstadt/
https://www.stampsx.com/ratgeber/ratgeber-theresienstadt.php
As mentioned in my post, I am by no means an expert. That is why I will be sending for certification. Some times I get lucky.
Thank you for your interest.
Mel
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Hello Mel,
As I write this it is 16:00 hours here. I think it is still morning overthere??
Well if you checked out all those points and there all oke.
And about the blue cross. I have darkend the picture and now he looks like this :
See the blue cross now?
Well futhermore I wish you luck with the certification.
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Yes, it is still morning here. Just went on daylight saving time and it is now 10:31. I must apologize, I only looked at the last picture you posted. Went back to the beginning and I do see the blue cross you mention. I cannot find any mark on the front of the stamp and that, along with the position of the mark on the back is the only thing that has me concerned.
Before I send for certification, do you have any recommendations on where to send? I plan to send to BPP, but would like to use someone in the US to save on cost.
Regards, Mel
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Phuh, recommendations.......
Well BPP ofcourse but then you have to send it to Germany.
But before you go into that read the following carefully.....
https://www.bpp.de/en/expertising-rules/
More on the menu ABOUT US.
I do not know if there are BPP certified people in the States.
I took a quick peek and saw only : Germany, Austria, Sweden, Switzerland
Expertiser GILBERT died a couple of years ago and I believe PÄTOW (or PAETOW without the A umlaut) too.
Expertiser of BOHMEN UND MAHREN is now-a-days Mister DETLEF PFEIFFER.
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
WOW! Just read the BPP rules from the link you posted. Very informative and precise. I have already sent an email to Mr. DETLEF PFEIFFER asking for his address and price. Found his email address on one of the Web sites I researched.
I also sent an email to the German Philatelic Society here in the US asking if they knew of anyone in the states that would be suitable for expertising the stamp.
Will let you know if I get any responses.
Best Wishes, Mel
PS: Thought I had already sent this response, but must have hit the wrong button. If a duplicate, I apologize.
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Glad to help.
Detlef Pfeiffer
Marksuhler Ring 9
71126 Gäufelden-Öschelbronn
Deutschland
pfeiffer-detlef@t-online.de
Expert areas
Bohemia and Moravia
Generalgouvernement
Mährisch-Ostrau Michel Nos. 1 – 63
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Presume these apply to the genuine stamp and not the forgery.
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Can you tell me where you found the information you just posted regarding the stamp. I want to add it to my bookmarks for future reference.
Thanks,
Mel
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
@mbo1142
one of my 150+ articles on WW forgeries (+1700 pages for now) - a 5 page article
I occasionally publish some on another site & will/might eventually publish a book
No website or blog access - too busy to maintain
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Mel,
I told you in the previous post,
"If you really want some information on this stamp goto the folowwing link :
http://stampforgeries.com/forged-stamps-of-theresienstadt/
"
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
I have already been to that site and have it bookmarked. In fact that is where I got most of my information regarding the stamp I have and where I found the information regarding Mr. Detlef Pfeiffer. That site only shows 6 items to look for. The picture posted by SForgCa shows 8 different items to look for and for the reason I was looking to add an additional source.
My stamp is on its way to Mr. Detlef Pfeiffer and when it returns, I will post here.
Mel
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
"HockeyNut -I even guess that the link I gave you is HIS site."
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Keeping my fingers crossed!!!
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
GUESS WHAT CAME IN THE MAIL TODAY, 2 1/2 MONTHS AFTER MAILING FROM GERMANY!!!!!
I am no a happy camper.
Mel
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Mel.
After waiting so long for the certificate I was surprised to read your comment, "I am no a happy camper". Very sorry to hear you are disappointed, so being the friend I am ... I will take the stamp off your hands.
Meanwhile, I'll keep my fingers crossed this was just bad grammar caused by months of isolation, not a bad typo or a stuck "w" key...
Dave.
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Dave,
Nice try. I was so excited that I did not even spel check
Mel
re: Theresienstadt Getto-Labor Camp Parcel Admission Stamp
Congratulations Mel.
Great piece to have and now certified too.