Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Have a look at these items.
It feels a bit like being Don Quixote fighting the windmills but I cannot repeat this enough: these are complete fakes and by no means worth the 20 / 25 or 30 dollars the seller claims.
Report these people and try to ignore their junk!
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If you had any doubts take a better look at the first stamp: why on earth would the Flemish (is Belgian) SS legion be advertised on a Dutch stamp? That's without going into the details that there never was a Flemish SS legion with this name.
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I think the seller may be in Arizona? If it's the same one I found on Ebay, I've bombarded him with messages and reported him for selling fakes, all to no avail.
He answered me once, saying that because his listings state "private issue", people should know they're bogus. I replied and called him an outright fraud.
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And the Schaepman semipostal stamp from 1936 lost its validity for postage three years before the war started.
Edit: the really funny part is with the grey flying dove definitive: cancelled 1942, yet overprinted Assen 1944!
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A certain rogernorth, reportedly from Texas
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It's a different guy. I've searched my records, and can't find the messages or any images on Ebay. Maybe he moved to Hipstamp and Texas!
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Unfortunately there are more than just one. I know of several who specialise in such fantasy material in the Netherlands as well.
The strange thing is they have over 3,000 positive feedback and hardly any negative.
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This type of counterfeit stamps have also arrived in Romania.
A seller from whom I bought many German stamps (genuine stamps) has been selling them for at least 1 year.
He confirmed me that he bought them from the United States.
This lot sells at the end for 4-5 Euro.
I don't buy such things but I am very curious to know the method of printing the overprint (printer? or are there devices designed for this purpose?).
I've seen a lot of overprint variants and I think it's a very big forgery activity.
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The seller ,Roger North from El Paso,TX ,also sells on Ebay.He lists numerous French WW2 overprints,none of which I have found in any catalogue.No mention in his listings if these are repros or genuine.
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The seller also has blocked all messages regarding these stamps.
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"The seller also has blocked all messages regarding these stamps."
Purely coincidence. I am sure he has nothing to hide.
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"That's without going into the details that there never was a Flemish SS legion with this name."
I want to place a remark here JanSimon :
The Flemish Legion (Dutch: Vlaams Legioen) was a collaborationist military formation recruited among Dutch-speaking volunteers from German-occupied Belgium, notably from Flanders, during World War II. It was formed in the aftermath of the German invasion of the Soviet Union and fought on the Eastern Front in the Waffen SS alongside similar formations from other parts of German-occupied Western Europe.
Established in July 1941, the Flemish Legion was envisaged by the Flemish National Union (Vlaams Nationaal Verbond, or VNV) as a means of maintaining its status as the principle collaborationist party within Flanders since the German invasion of May 1940. It was formed several months after the VNV had begun recruiting Flemish volunteers for smaller Waffen SS formations and was depicted as the future army of an independent Flemish state. Amid opposition from its personnel, the roughly 1,000-strong formation was given a notionally independent status as an SS Volunteer Legion Flanders (SS-Freiwilligen Legion Flandern). It subsequently sustained heavy casualties on the Eastern Front in fighting around Leningrad.
The Flemish Legion was officially disbanded in May 1943 and reformed within the Waffen-SS as the SS Assault Brigade Langemarck (SS-Sturmbrigade Langemarck). 200 soldiers refused to swear allegiance to Adolf Hitler in October 1943 and were transferred to other units or penal units. It was subsequently reorganised on several occasions and was officially designated as a division in September 1944 but remained around 2,000-strong and never expanded beyond brigade-strength. It participated in fighting in Ukraine, Estonia, and Pomerania. Its remaining personnel finally surrendered to the Red Army at Mecklenburg on 3 May 1945.
Belgien - Flamische Legion. Gefalligheitsstempel aus Brussel gepruft TRUST
SS Assault Brigade Langemark
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But otherwise you are right JanSimon.
It's all junk what they sell.
We've already talked more about this in this Europe / Germany section.
Other readers interested?
Hit the link below
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=17808#168808
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My point was that although there were several Flemish legions, none of them was called SS Legion Flanders, which is what you basically confirm in your informative story.
Swastikas sell...
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If anyone comes across these stamps I am interested
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Any info on how these are different from the German things we just discussed?
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Report to Hipstamp. They tend to be more receptive than ebay, where you never expect a response, let alone an action!
As a general warning, overprints often equal counterfeits if the stated value is over $10 (and I am being generous)
rrr...
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"Any info on how these are different from the German things we just discussed?"
Well JanSimon look at the next picture of my michel-catalog :
Michel is wrong here in there description.
Those are French stamps but issued by the Flemish State (Vlaamse Staat) who still had sympathy for Germany
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The green stamp has an overprint "Houdt Goeden Moed"
just as the Michel stated.
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That's interesting. I have just checked my Michel specialized Germany catalogue and this is not listed. Perhaps it is something that came up recently, my catalogue is from 2011.
The first one, the flying dove is well known. The others are new to me.
As a matter of fact, I have never heard of this resistance leader Van den Ban, which of course does not have to mean anything (I do not know all the resistance leaders but some are better known than others and Google does not give me any leads either). Another strange thing is that I was under the impression that all Wilhelmina stamps were taken out of circulation by the Germans in 1940, so how can there be use of them in 1942? Wouldn't that lead to enormous suspicion, or even a refusal to process such a letter?
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Hi JanSimon.
This is what I found in a book
Dutch War Post around the 2nd World War PART 2
from Drs W.J. van Doorn
""I quote Joachim Hosang:
The real stamps were marked with the imprint "HOUDT GOEDEN MOED" in a similar color to the stamps themselves. Very few stamps have been made that speak the information I received from the Netherlands from 90 pieces for the 5 cents stamp and even less for the 12,5 cents stamp""
Furthermore, Mr van Doorn tells
Mr P.J. van den Ban lived in Rotterdam in 1941, moved to Nieuw-Vossemeer during the war and was there after the war from December 1944 to January 1948 acting mayor.
Later, Mr. van den Ban emigrated.
The book does not tell where to...
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The plot thickens...
It's curious, Joachim Hosang wrote in his "Gezähnte Propaganda" about this in 1955 or 1956, yet it took Michel until some date between 2011 and now to include this propaganda forgery in their catalogue. Why did it take so long? It is not that Hosang was an obscure writer, his book was translated into English only a year after its original publication as "stamps in battledress".
On the other hand, after some further investigation I found an article from the Dutch magazine "Philatelie" from May 1984 in which this overprint is described. According to the writer he found a number of unadressed covers with the 5 cent stamp in a box he bought at an auction in 1950. All were cancelled but unaddressed and as far as the author of the article knows, no stamps have ever been really put into circulation. According to the author, the person who initiated the overprint "was probably startled by his own courage".
The resistance person who came up with the idea is identified as "J. van der B.", living at Geuzenlaan 8a, Rotterdam-West. I do not yet know how J. van der B. has turned into P.J. van den Ban.
Here is one of the envelopes in question.
Of course one of the most important questions is whether the author (I could not find his name) tells the truth or made this up to provide provenance in order to sell his forgeries.
To be continued...
Edit:
The Geuzenlaan in Rotterdam-West was not a street where the better situated Rotterdammers lived. I have not been able to find anyone in that street in possession of a telephone in 1940 or 1941. In 1939 Geuzenlaan 8a, the address where the resistance leader J. van der B. was supposed to live, was the home of a Jan Deijl and his wife Johanna. Jan worked in a warehouse. It is unclear whether they moved a few years later and "J. van der B." moved in.
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Bye the way JanSimon
My Michel Catalog is from 2017.
And I really have no idea why the Michel catalog did not mention this before.
Maybe investigation took a long time?
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Just had a quick look on the Hipstamp site and was quickly reminded that there are still people around trying to rip you off.
Have a look at these items.
It feels a bit like being Don Quixote fighting the windmills but I cannot repeat this enough: these are complete fakes and by no means worth the 20 / 25 or 30 dollars the seller claims.
Report these people and try to ignore their junk!
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
Approvals
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
If you had any doubts take a better look at the first stamp: why on earth would the Flemish (is Belgian) SS legion be advertised on a Dutch stamp? That's without going into the details that there never was a Flemish SS legion with this name.
Login to Like
this post
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
I think the seller may be in Arizona? If it's the same one I found on Ebay, I've bombarded him with messages and reported him for selling fakes, all to no avail.
He answered me once, saying that because his listings state "private issue", people should know they're bogus. I replied and called him an outright fraud.
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like this post.
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re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
And the Schaepman semipostal stamp from 1936 lost its validity for postage three years before the war started.
Edit: the really funny part is with the grey flying dove definitive: cancelled 1942, yet overprinted Assen 1944!
Login to Like
this post
Approvals
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
A certain rogernorth, reportedly from Texas
Login to Like
this post
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
It's a different guy. I've searched my records, and can't find the messages or any images on Ebay. Maybe he moved to Hipstamp and Texas!
Login to Like
this post
Approvals
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
Unfortunately there are more than just one. I know of several who specialise in such fantasy material in the Netherlands as well.
The strange thing is they have over 3,000 positive feedback and hardly any negative.
Login to Like
this post
09:12:56am
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
This type of counterfeit stamps have also arrived in Romania.
A seller from whom I bought many German stamps (genuine stamps) has been selling them for at least 1 year.
He confirmed me that he bought them from the United States.
This lot sells at the end for 4-5 Euro.
I don't buy such things but I am very curious to know the method of printing the overprint (printer? or are there devices designed for this purpose?).
I've seen a lot of overprint variants and I think it's a very big forgery activity.
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Login to Like.
09:13:04am
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
The seller ,Roger North from El Paso,TX ,also sells on Ebay.He lists numerous French WW2 overprints,none of which I have found in any catalogue.No mention in his listings if these are repros or genuine.
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09:15:41am
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
The seller also has blocked all messages regarding these stamps.
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re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
"The seller also has blocked all messages regarding these stamps."
Purely coincidence. I am sure he has nothing to hide.
Login to Like
this post
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
"That's without going into the details that there never was a Flemish SS legion with this name."
I want to place a remark here JanSimon :
The Flemish Legion (Dutch: Vlaams Legioen) was a collaborationist military formation recruited among Dutch-speaking volunteers from German-occupied Belgium, notably from Flanders, during World War II. It was formed in the aftermath of the German invasion of the Soviet Union and fought on the Eastern Front in the Waffen SS alongside similar formations from other parts of German-occupied Western Europe.
Established in July 1941, the Flemish Legion was envisaged by the Flemish National Union (Vlaams Nationaal Verbond, or VNV) as a means of maintaining its status as the principle collaborationist party within Flanders since the German invasion of May 1940. It was formed several months after the VNV had begun recruiting Flemish volunteers for smaller Waffen SS formations and was depicted as the future army of an independent Flemish state. Amid opposition from its personnel, the roughly 1,000-strong formation was given a notionally independent status as an SS Volunteer Legion Flanders (SS-Freiwilligen Legion Flandern). It subsequently sustained heavy casualties on the Eastern Front in fighting around Leningrad.
The Flemish Legion was officially disbanded in May 1943 and reformed within the Waffen-SS as the SS Assault Brigade Langemarck (SS-Sturmbrigade Langemarck). 200 soldiers refused to swear allegiance to Adolf Hitler in October 1943 and were transferred to other units or penal units. It was subsequently reorganised on several occasions and was officially designated as a division in September 1944 but remained around 2,000-strong and never expanded beyond brigade-strength. It participated in fighting in Ukraine, Estonia, and Pomerania. Its remaining personnel finally surrendered to the Red Army at Mecklenburg on 3 May 1945.
Belgien - Flamische Legion. Gefalligheitsstempel aus Brussel gepruft TRUST
SS Assault Brigade Langemark
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re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
But otherwise you are right JanSimon.
It's all junk what they sell.
We've already talked more about this in this Europe / Germany section.
Other readers interested?
Hit the link below
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=17808#168808
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
Approvals
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
My point was that although there were several Flemish legions, none of them was called SS Legion Flanders, which is what you basically confirm in your informative story.
Swastikas sell...
Login to Like
this post
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
If anyone comes across these stamps I am interested
Login to Like
this post
Approvals
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
Any info on how these are different from the German things we just discussed?
Login to Like
this post
Approvals
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
Report to Hipstamp. They tend to be more receptive than ebay, where you never expect a response, let alone an action!
As a general warning, overprints often equal counterfeits if the stated value is over $10 (and I am being generous)
rrr...
Login to Like
this post
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
"Any info on how these are different from the German things we just discussed?"
Well JanSimon look at the next picture of my michel-catalog :
Michel is wrong here in there description.
Those are French stamps but issued by the Flemish State (Vlaamse Staat) who still had sympathy for Germany
Login to Like
this post
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
The green stamp has an overprint "Houdt Goeden Moed"
just as the Michel stated.
Login to Like
this post
Approvals
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
That's interesting. I have just checked my Michel specialized Germany catalogue and this is not listed. Perhaps it is something that came up recently, my catalogue is from 2011.
The first one, the flying dove is well known. The others are new to me.
As a matter of fact, I have never heard of this resistance leader Van den Ban, which of course does not have to mean anything (I do not know all the resistance leaders but some are better known than others and Google does not give me any leads either). Another strange thing is that I was under the impression that all Wilhelmina stamps were taken out of circulation by the Germans in 1940, so how can there be use of them in 1942? Wouldn't that lead to enormous suspicion, or even a refusal to process such a letter?
Login to Like
this post
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
Hi JanSimon.
This is what I found in a book
Dutch War Post around the 2nd World War PART 2
from Drs W.J. van Doorn
""I quote Joachim Hosang:
The real stamps were marked with the imprint "HOUDT GOEDEN MOED" in a similar color to the stamps themselves. Very few stamps have been made that speak the information I received from the Netherlands from 90 pieces for the 5 cents stamp and even less for the 12,5 cents stamp""
Furthermore, Mr van Doorn tells
Mr P.J. van den Ban lived in Rotterdam in 1941, moved to Nieuw-Vossemeer during the war and was there after the war from December 1944 to January 1948 acting mayor.
Later, Mr. van den Ban emigrated.
The book does not tell where to...
Login to Like
this post
Approvals
re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
The plot thickens...
It's curious, Joachim Hosang wrote in his "Gezähnte Propaganda" about this in 1955 or 1956, yet it took Michel until some date between 2011 and now to include this propaganda forgery in their catalogue. Why did it take so long? It is not that Hosang was an obscure writer, his book was translated into English only a year after its original publication as "stamps in battledress".
On the other hand, after some further investigation I found an article from the Dutch magazine "Philatelie" from May 1984 in which this overprint is described. According to the writer he found a number of unadressed covers with the 5 cent stamp in a box he bought at an auction in 1950. All were cancelled but unaddressed and as far as the author of the article knows, no stamps have ever been really put into circulation. According to the author, the person who initiated the overprint "was probably startled by his own courage".
The resistance person who came up with the idea is identified as "J. van der B.", living at Geuzenlaan 8a, Rotterdam-West. I do not yet know how J. van der B. has turned into P.J. van den Ban.
Here is one of the envelopes in question.
Of course one of the most important questions is whether the author (I could not find his name) tells the truth or made this up to provide provenance in order to sell his forgeries.
To be continued...
Edit:
The Geuzenlaan in Rotterdam-West was not a street where the better situated Rotterdammers lived. I have not been able to find anyone in that street in possession of a telephone in 1940 or 1941. In 1939 Geuzenlaan 8a, the address where the resistance leader J. van der B. was supposed to live, was the home of a Jan Deijl and his wife Johanna. Jan worked in a warehouse. It is unclear whether they moved a few years later and "J. van der B." moved in.
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re: The creative criminals are still working overtime
Bye the way JanSimon
My Michel Catalog is from 2017.
And I really have no idea why the Michel catalog did not mention this before.
Maybe investigation took a long time?
Login to Like
this post