Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
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This response won't be of much help, but is food for thought.
My stamp club, the BC Philatelic Society (Vancouver, BC), recently had a presentation by Ken Pugh, who is one of Canada's foremost experts on forgeries. His specialty is modern forgeries, and he has been a witness for the prosecution in federal cases against forgers, and has also received death threats. However, he is also an expert on older forged stamps.
A main point that he made: "Expert" opinions from "expertization committees" are far from expert. He has had personal experience with forgeries which have been "expertized" as genuine, and with genuine stamps which have been "expertized" as forgeries. He recently identified a "forged," "expertized" stamp in his own collection which is clearly genuine, and worth many thousand dollars more than the $20 he paid for it.
This was Ken's second presentation to us. He repeated an earlier assertion, that forgeries of stamps and postcards, even inexpensive stamps and postcards, abound. The philatelic marketplace is truly a place where the buyer must beware.
Bob
(Message edited by Bobstamp on January 19, 2011)
(Message edited by Bobstamp on January 19, 2011)
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I have used the service and discovered that there is no set board that examines these stamps. The APS sends the stamps out to members who are supposedly knowledgeable in the area, and they give their opinion. Also I had to wait many months to get the opinion. I gave the stamp to Regency Superior for their auction, Italy #26 unused, no gum. APS charged me based on the mint price of 2000.00. Regency figured the stamp at just a few hundred dollars. I complained to APS, and they did refund me the difference.
I should think that there should be more than just one person examining a stamp.
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Bob
Thank you for the response.
I sent a query to the APS Director of Expertization asking him if the assertion that most dealers would not honor the APEX certificate was true. He emphatically stated that it was not true.
I just purchased a two books on "Philatelic Expertizing" published by the Philatelic Foundation. The authors there did not feel that there were many forgeries of inexpensive stamps because of the lack of potential profit.
My intent in starting the thread was to decide who has the best reputation in the field. Expertizing is expensive and if the process is routinely wrong, then why waste the money. By my count there are at least 5 services advertised on line or in the literature. I am sure there are more.
Here is to hoping for more food for thought.
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rgnpcs,
Just curious why did Regency downgrade the stamp? I believe that APS does not grade the stamp in question on centering, just asserts whether the stamp is genuine and describes its condition.
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Les said, "I just purchased a two books on "Philatelic Expertizing" published by the Philatelic Foundation. The authors there did not feel that there were many forgeries of inexpensive stamps because of the lack of potential profit."
"Not many" is probably subjective and unproveable. A case in point is the Japanese "Mt. Fuji" stamps issued after the war. The printing plates were purchased by a Hungarian company, which proceeded to print kazillions of copies for the packet trade.
Ken Pugh busted a forger, a school teacher, who was selling relatively inexpensive forgeries of 1800s Canadian covers on eBay. It didn't become a police issue and the guy promised Ken to stop doing what he was doing.
I have learned that overprints are often forged. One evening at my stamp club, the president showed an overprinted stamp he was very proud of. I took a look with my magnifying glass and immediately noticed that the overprint was over the cancellation. When I pointed it out to the president, he refused to talk to me about it!
Bob
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APS graded the stamp on the certificate, unused, no gum, genuine. and I paid them based on the full gum figure. Based on the fact that I was charged for the appraisal on the full gum figure, this is the figure I gave to Regency. Regency graded the stamp based on no gum, and of course lowered the minimum bid, which I agreed with. Based on the Regency figure, I then phoned APS, and told them, and they agreed, and gave me the refund.
BTW, stamp did not sell.
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Bob said "Not many" is probably subjective and unproveable. Agreed!
On further reflection: the Philatelic Foundation monographs predate the digital marketplace which presents the inexpensive forger a lucrative market.
The other common "forgery" exploits the "no hinge fad". Regumming and careful hinge removal to camouflage the fact that the stamp has been hinged is probably far more common today. The expertizer is well served to have access to a reference library with examples of the original gum. A local (in Brandon, FL) former stamp dealer said that before air conditioning it was common for collectors to soak the gum off of mint stamps to preclude them from sticking to album pages. He also remarked that he had seen complete sets of no-gum Columbians. My own Columbians show several varieties of gum.
Les
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RGNPCS said "APS graded the stamp on the certificate, unused, no gum, genuine. and I paid them based on the full gum figure. Based on the fact that I was charged for the appraisal on the full gum figure, this is the figure I gave to Regency."
APS charges are supposedly based on a percentage of catalog value. APS overvalued the stamp and should have adjusted your cost even if you were not selling the stamp.
Yes I agree that there should be a panel of experts with access to a reference library containing genuine examples of the stamps in question. Does any expertizing service do that or do they follow the practice of forwarding the stamp to acknowledged expert.
Les
(Message edited by Les on January 20, 2011)
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If i had not placed the stamp in auction, I never would have known that the APS inflated the catalog value.
Unfortunately, one needs a certificate to sell certain stamps, and this costs.
Regarding gum on the US Columbian issue of 1893, most, if not all of the original gum is cracked. Years ago it was advised to soak the gum off of these stamps, for the gum could also destroy the paper, and many people did remove the gum. If you have a Columbian with nice smooth gum, then it has been regummed.
Richaard
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11:57:27pm
When I pointed it out to the president, he refused to talk to me about it!
LOLOL
I bet he won't show you anything else for a long time either. The risks of being the messenger.
.
Charlie Jensen
Still chuckling
Lecnto, Florida
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I also chuckled a little bit when I read Bob's discovery of an overprint printed over the cancel: "When I pointed it out to the president, he refused to talk to me about it!" True, the messenger is rarely appreciated.
Now and then we read about Art Museums admitting to acquiring in decades past a forged painting or other works of art.
Fake antiques were sold in Roman flea markets 2000 years ago--a brisk trade if accounts are credible!
Forging collectibles has been around a long time. Experts can be fooled like anyone else.
When I was a kid, pulling open the drawstring of the orange bag to get at my stamps from the missions, I never thought a day would arrive when I needed to have stamps expertized. I was too busy sorting, soaking and hoping to find an upside down Jenny in the flotsam and jetsam of brightly-colored stamps from all over the world.
It's difficult to recommend an expertizing service. It seems like they've all been tarnished or fooled at times. Certain German prufers or expertizers have been caught playing fast and loose with their opinions. I suppose that is the key word: Opinion.
Perhaps a collector's best defense is to read up on an issue, delve into the literature, form an opinion after some serious study and if possible engage in conversations with other knowledgeable collectors -- then if necessary make a submission to an expertizing service. Part of one's research would have to include finding out which expertizing services are respected for which particular country or issue.
I believe I've read there was a movement afoot not to mark a stamp either genuine or forged since enough opinions have been reversed one way or another. Has this actually happened or are stamps still marked on the back?
A high dpi scan of the front and back should do the the trick in case the opinion is reversed at a later date--the stamp has not been marred. Naturally, these certificates and expertizing marks when applied to the stamp can be forged as well.
Caveat emptor!
Bruce
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About that overprint over the cancellation: The president not only refused to talk about it, he wouldn't even look at it. I offered him my loupe, but he just shook his head and stared straight ahead with a sort of thousand-yard stare. I know that stare — it's often seen among combat veterans suffering from PTSD. My wife has often seen it on me: it's a sure sign that the person who is staring has "left the room," so to speak. Perhaps he was thinking of killing the person who sold him that stamp!
Bob
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Denial is more than just a river.
Bruce
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02:15:59pm
Once you reach your conclusion you usually stop thinking.
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Well, I succeeded in provoking the discussion, but I don't know if I am getting the answer that I sought.
Please correct me if I am wrong, APS will only determine if the stamps in question are genuine. They will assess the state of the gum and give an opinion as to whether it is present, original or regummed. APS does not determine the grade.
Anyone with access to Scott's examples can grade a stamp's centering. Although telling the difference between an "80" and a "95" may be a bit problematic. Coupling the grading with a digital scan can allow the buyer to agree or disagree with the grading.
The market's apparent disdain for the APEX certificate seems to be rooted in their unwillingness to grade the stamp. The other concern seems to be the apocryphal tales of mistakes.
From all that I have read about expertizing as a process, APS should be the best choice. They have a reference collection of originals and fakes, access to most of the literature describing printing processes and uses, and knowledge of subsequent collecting practices. What about Philtelic Foundation, PSE, and etc?
Les
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Les,
You are correct: APS determines if the stamp is genuuine and notes charastics such as original gum, or regummed; creases and other damage. They often leave other elements unremarked, such as type of cancellation, etc. They do not grade the stamp, either according to Scott lettering nor according to PSE's numerical grading.
I haven't heard that there was disdain for these certificates, however, if there is, it may well be related to the potential for large profits from stamps with high numerical grades. I'm speculating here.
David
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Doesn't APS offer much more of a "guarantee" than the others? Or is that urban legend?
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David,
I noted that GeorgetownLaw on eBay has on his store the clear warning that he does not honor APEX certificates. Whether that is a full blown certificate or the new APEX version which just examines a scan to identify the stamp is not very clear. That is the source of my remark about disdain. Also he says that most stamp dealers do not honor APEX certificates.
Les
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I also notice that this particular seller doesn't refund the cost of the cert for items that don't pass muster, which I would say is not consistent with the policy of most major dealers and auction houses.
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Les,
does looking at the scan produce a certificate?
i hadn't heard that before; but i haven't used APS for a certificate for 15 years (nor anyone else, ever)
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Here is a copy from the APS website:
"Welcome to Quick I.D., the newest Member Service offered by the American Philatelic Society. Perhaps you’re considering buying a stamp off the Internet, but aren’t sure it is properly identified. Or maybe you have a question about a stamp you already own. Here is your opportunity to identify that stamp at a substantially lower cost than through the formal certification process offered by the American Philatelic Expertizing Service (APEX).
For those who have scanning capabilities, the process is particularly quick and easy. All you have to do is provide a scan of each item you wish identified and send it to Quick I.D. as a .gif or .jpeg (this is case sensitive -- use all lower case), using the online application form provided. If you don’t have a scanner, click here.
Image quality should be at least 200 dpi. For items from the Internet, simply copy the page and save it in a folder; from there you can treat it like a scanned image."
I believe that the Quick ID service is a response to the technology and digital marketplace.
I haven't used the service. I will say that using my Xerox Documate scanner coupled with Adobe photoshop elements to produce the scans for the auction here produces some really fine imagery. A knowledgeable observer should be able to eliminate poor fakes. On the other hand the capability of digital imaging with quality printing may make the production of high quality counterfeit stamps truly affordable.
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11:47:06am
I suppose we should also consider the scammer who could show a scan of a genuine stamp on the auction page and provide a fake to the buyer.
.
What a world we are living in.
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Cdj1122 said, "A knowledgeable observer should be able to eliminate poor fakes."
That's probably true, generally speaking. However, the forgers are getting very good. In his first talk to the BC Philatelic Society, Ken Pugh (mentioned above) showed us an example of a forgery of a recent Canada booklet pane. A "knowledgeable observer" named Ken Pugh could not determine that the stamps were forgeries, they were that good. However, the covers of the booklet panes were clearly fakes. I guess the forgers didn't realize that some collectors care about and know about such things as booklet covers.
I should mention that these forgeries were not intended for the philatelic market, but were being distributed at wholesale prices to corner stores and, in one case to, ahem, a well-known Canadian dealer who was using them for postage! The forgeries were apparently being produced in Russia.
Several years ago, a "seller" in Williams Lake, British Columbia tried to sell an Inverted Jenny on eBay. It got some large bids, but when one potential buyer asked to see the stamp before bidding (he was willing to travel to Williams Lake from the U.S.) the seller made some excuse, which of course made the whole thing started to smell like decomposing fish. Eventually it came to light that the "stamp" had been scanned from a philatelic publication. The last thing I heard about it was that the R.C.M.P. was investigating.
Bob
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Bob,
How interesting. There just happens to be an "inverted jenny" on eBay right now. The owner wants a mere $500,000 and claims it came from a collection. Even shows a scan. Maybe we should copy it and send it to APS for the Quick ID service.
Bye the way: Putting my money "where my mouth or rather where my fingers are." I did send a 292 that I purchased a few weeks ago to APS for their expert opinion. I purchased it from a very reputable dealer and at a very reasonable price given its condition. However, when I looked at the stamp really closely the "one" on the bottom inscription looked a bit off.
We shall see.
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10:31:03am
" .... Several years ago, a "seller" in Williams Lake, British Columbia tried to sell an Inverted Jenny on eBay. ...."
I remember reading about that incident, Bob. I thought the trusty Mounties apprehended the guy and his defense was something along the line that he was offering exactly what the scan on the eBay auction page showed, to wit; a picture of an inverted Jenny.
It was a few years ago and at home I think I have some of the clippings from Linns Stamp News in a folder somewhere that reported it.
If my feeble mind remembers it I can probably find the folder when I get back to my stamp room and settled in.
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I am an APS member 217747. I joined primarily to use the expertizing service. I have seen postings on eBay which say that the APEX certificate is not honored by many stamp dealers. What do you as Stamporama members think about the APEX certificate? Do you consider it a valid opinion on the genuineness of a stamp? Would you pay a premium for a stamp because it has been a subject of an APEX investigation and validated as genuine?
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re: APEX Certificates
This response won't be of much help, but is food for thought.
My stamp club, the BC Philatelic Society (Vancouver, BC), recently had a presentation by Ken Pugh, who is one of Canada's foremost experts on forgeries. His specialty is modern forgeries, and he has been a witness for the prosecution in federal cases against forgers, and has also received death threats. However, he is also an expert on older forged stamps.
A main point that he made: "Expert" opinions from "expertization committees" are far from expert. He has had personal experience with forgeries which have been "expertized" as genuine, and with genuine stamps which have been "expertized" as forgeries. He recently identified a "forged," "expertized" stamp in his own collection which is clearly genuine, and worth many thousand dollars more than the $20 he paid for it.
This was Ken's second presentation to us. He repeated an earlier assertion, that forgeries of stamps and postcards, even inexpensive stamps and postcards, abound. The philatelic marketplace is truly a place where the buyer must beware.
Bob
(Message edited by Bobstamp on January 19, 2011)
(Message edited by Bobstamp on January 19, 2011)
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re: APEX Certificates
I have used the service and discovered that there is no set board that examines these stamps. The APS sends the stamps out to members who are supposedly knowledgeable in the area, and they give their opinion. Also I had to wait many months to get the opinion. I gave the stamp to Regency Superior for their auction, Italy #26 unused, no gum. APS charged me based on the mint price of 2000.00. Regency figured the stamp at just a few hundred dollars. I complained to APS, and they did refund me the difference.
I should think that there should be more than just one person examining a stamp.
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re: APEX Certificates
Bob
Thank you for the response.
I sent a query to the APS Director of Expertization asking him if the assertion that most dealers would not honor the APEX certificate was true. He emphatically stated that it was not true.
I just purchased a two books on "Philatelic Expertizing" published by the Philatelic Foundation. The authors there did not feel that there were many forgeries of inexpensive stamps because of the lack of potential profit.
My intent in starting the thread was to decide who has the best reputation in the field. Expertizing is expensive and if the process is routinely wrong, then why waste the money. By my count there are at least 5 services advertised on line or in the literature. I am sure there are more.
Here is to hoping for more food for thought.
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re: APEX Certificates
rgnpcs,
Just curious why did Regency downgrade the stamp? I believe that APS does not grade the stamp in question on centering, just asserts whether the stamp is genuine and describes its condition.
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re: APEX Certificates
Les said, "I just purchased a two books on "Philatelic Expertizing" published by the Philatelic Foundation. The authors there did not feel that there were many forgeries of inexpensive stamps because of the lack of potential profit."
"Not many" is probably subjective and unproveable. A case in point is the Japanese "Mt. Fuji" stamps issued after the war. The printing plates were purchased by a Hungarian company, which proceeded to print kazillions of copies for the packet trade.
Ken Pugh busted a forger, a school teacher, who was selling relatively inexpensive forgeries of 1800s Canadian covers on eBay. It didn't become a police issue and the guy promised Ken to stop doing what he was doing.
I have learned that overprints are often forged. One evening at my stamp club, the president showed an overprinted stamp he was very proud of. I took a look with my magnifying glass and immediately noticed that the overprint was over the cancellation. When I pointed it out to the president, he refused to talk to me about it!
Bob
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re: APEX Certificates
APS graded the stamp on the certificate, unused, no gum, genuine. and I paid them based on the full gum figure. Based on the fact that I was charged for the appraisal on the full gum figure, this is the figure I gave to Regency. Regency graded the stamp based on no gum, and of course lowered the minimum bid, which I agreed with. Based on the Regency figure, I then phoned APS, and told them, and they agreed, and gave me the refund.
BTW, stamp did not sell.
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re: APEX Certificates
Bob said "Not many" is probably subjective and unproveable. Agreed!
On further reflection: the Philatelic Foundation monographs predate the digital marketplace which presents the inexpensive forger a lucrative market.
The other common "forgery" exploits the "no hinge fad". Regumming and careful hinge removal to camouflage the fact that the stamp has been hinged is probably far more common today. The expertizer is well served to have access to a reference library with examples of the original gum. A local (in Brandon, FL) former stamp dealer said that before air conditioning it was common for collectors to soak the gum off of mint stamps to preclude them from sticking to album pages. He also remarked that he had seen complete sets of no-gum Columbians. My own Columbians show several varieties of gum.
Les
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re: APEX Certificates
RGNPCS said "APS graded the stamp on the certificate, unused, no gum, genuine. and I paid them based on the full gum figure. Based on the fact that I was charged for the appraisal on the full gum figure, this is the figure I gave to Regency."
APS charges are supposedly based on a percentage of catalog value. APS overvalued the stamp and should have adjusted your cost even if you were not selling the stamp.
Yes I agree that there should be a panel of experts with access to a reference library containing genuine examples of the stamps in question. Does any expertizing service do that or do they follow the practice of forwarding the stamp to acknowledged expert.
Les
(Message edited by Les on January 20, 2011)
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re: APEX Certificates
If i had not placed the stamp in auction, I never would have known that the APS inflated the catalog value.
Unfortunately, one needs a certificate to sell certain stamps, and this costs.
Regarding gum on the US Columbian issue of 1893, most, if not all of the original gum is cracked. Years ago it was advised to soak the gum off of these stamps, for the gum could also destroy the paper, and many people did remove the gum. If you have a Columbian with nice smooth gum, then it has been regummed.
Richaard
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
20 Jan 2011
11:57:27pm
re: APEX Certificates
When I pointed it out to the president, he refused to talk to me about it!
LOLOL
I bet he won't show you anything else for a long time either. The risks of being the messenger.
.
Charlie Jensen
Still chuckling
Lecnto, Florida
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10:15:08am
re: APEX Certificates
I also chuckled a little bit when I read Bob's discovery of an overprint printed over the cancel: "When I pointed it out to the president, he refused to talk to me about it!" True, the messenger is rarely appreciated.
Now and then we read about Art Museums admitting to acquiring in decades past a forged painting or other works of art.
Fake antiques were sold in Roman flea markets 2000 years ago--a brisk trade if accounts are credible!
Forging collectibles has been around a long time. Experts can be fooled like anyone else.
When I was a kid, pulling open the drawstring of the orange bag to get at my stamps from the missions, I never thought a day would arrive when I needed to have stamps expertized. I was too busy sorting, soaking and hoping to find an upside down Jenny in the flotsam and jetsam of brightly-colored stamps from all over the world.
It's difficult to recommend an expertizing service. It seems like they've all been tarnished or fooled at times. Certain German prufers or expertizers have been caught playing fast and loose with their opinions. I suppose that is the key word: Opinion.
Perhaps a collector's best defense is to read up on an issue, delve into the literature, form an opinion after some serious study and if possible engage in conversations with other knowledgeable collectors -- then if necessary make a submission to an expertizing service. Part of one's research would have to include finding out which expertizing services are respected for which particular country or issue.
I believe I've read there was a movement afoot not to mark a stamp either genuine or forged since enough opinions have been reversed one way or another. Has this actually happened or are stamps still marked on the back?
A high dpi scan of the front and back should do the the trick in case the opinion is reversed at a later date--the stamp has not been marred. Naturally, these certificates and expertizing marks when applied to the stamp can be forged as well.
Caveat emptor!
Bruce
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re: APEX Certificates
About that overprint over the cancellation: The president not only refused to talk about it, he wouldn't even look at it. I offered him my loupe, but he just shook his head and stared straight ahead with a sort of thousand-yard stare. I know that stare — it's often seen among combat veterans suffering from PTSD. My wife has often seen it on me: it's a sure sign that the person who is staring has "left the room," so to speak. Perhaps he was thinking of killing the person who sold him that stamp!
Bob
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11:48:30am
re: APEX Certificates
Denial is more than just a river.
Bruce
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
21 Jan 2011
02:15:59pm
re: APEX Certificates
Once you reach your conclusion you usually stop thinking.
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re: APEX Certificates
Well, I succeeded in provoking the discussion, but I don't know if I am getting the answer that I sought.
Please correct me if I am wrong, APS will only determine if the stamps in question are genuine. They will assess the state of the gum and give an opinion as to whether it is present, original or regummed. APS does not determine the grade.
Anyone with access to Scott's examples can grade a stamp's centering. Although telling the difference between an "80" and a "95" may be a bit problematic. Coupling the grading with a digital scan can allow the buyer to agree or disagree with the grading.
The market's apparent disdain for the APEX certificate seems to be rooted in their unwillingness to grade the stamp. The other concern seems to be the apocryphal tales of mistakes.
From all that I have read about expertizing as a process, APS should be the best choice. They have a reference collection of originals and fakes, access to most of the literature describing printing processes and uses, and knowledge of subsequent collecting practices. What about Philtelic Foundation, PSE, and etc?
Les
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re: APEX Certificates
Les,
You are correct: APS determines if the stamp is genuuine and notes charastics such as original gum, or regummed; creases and other damage. They often leave other elements unremarked, such as type of cancellation, etc. They do not grade the stamp, either according to Scott lettering nor according to PSE's numerical grading.
I haven't heard that there was disdain for these certificates, however, if there is, it may well be related to the potential for large profits from stamps with high numerical grades. I'm speculating here.
David
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re: APEX Certificates
Doesn't APS offer much more of a "guarantee" than the others? Or is that urban legend?
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re: APEX Certificates
David,
I noted that GeorgetownLaw on eBay has on his store the clear warning that he does not honor APEX certificates. Whether that is a full blown certificate or the new APEX version which just examines a scan to identify the stamp is not very clear. That is the source of my remark about disdain. Also he says that most stamp dealers do not honor APEX certificates.
Les
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re: APEX Certificates
I also notice that this particular seller doesn't refund the cost of the cert for items that don't pass muster, which I would say is not consistent with the policy of most major dealers and auction houses.
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re: APEX Certificates
Les,
does looking at the scan produce a certificate?
i hadn't heard that before; but i haven't used APS for a certificate for 15 years (nor anyone else, ever)
Login to Like
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re: APEX Certificates
Here is a copy from the APS website:
"Welcome to Quick I.D., the newest Member Service offered by the American Philatelic Society. Perhaps you’re considering buying a stamp off the Internet, but aren’t sure it is properly identified. Or maybe you have a question about a stamp you already own. Here is your opportunity to identify that stamp at a substantially lower cost than through the formal certification process offered by the American Philatelic Expertizing Service (APEX).
For those who have scanning capabilities, the process is particularly quick and easy. All you have to do is provide a scan of each item you wish identified and send it to Quick I.D. as a .gif or .jpeg (this is case sensitive -- use all lower case), using the online application form provided. If you don’t have a scanner, click here.
Image quality should be at least 200 dpi. For items from the Internet, simply copy the page and save it in a folder; from there you can treat it like a scanned image."
I believe that the Quick ID service is a response to the technology and digital marketplace.
I haven't used the service. I will say that using my Xerox Documate scanner coupled with Adobe photoshop elements to produce the scans for the auction here produces some really fine imagery. A knowledgeable observer should be able to eliminate poor fakes. On the other hand the capability of digital imaging with quality printing may make the production of high quality counterfeit stamps truly affordable.
Login to Like
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
26 Jan 2011
11:47:06am
re: APEX Certificates
I suppose we should also consider the scammer who could show a scan of a genuine stamp on the auction page and provide a fake to the buyer.
.
What a world we are living in.
Login to Like
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re: APEX Certificates
Cdj1122 said, "A knowledgeable observer should be able to eliminate poor fakes."
That's probably true, generally speaking. However, the forgers are getting very good. In his first talk to the BC Philatelic Society, Ken Pugh (mentioned above) showed us an example of a forgery of a recent Canada booklet pane. A "knowledgeable observer" named Ken Pugh could not determine that the stamps were forgeries, they were that good. However, the covers of the booklet panes were clearly fakes. I guess the forgers didn't realize that some collectors care about and know about such things as booklet covers.
I should mention that these forgeries were not intended for the philatelic market, but were being distributed at wholesale prices to corner stores and, in one case to, ahem, a well-known Canadian dealer who was using them for postage! The forgeries were apparently being produced in Russia.
Several years ago, a "seller" in Williams Lake, British Columbia tried to sell an Inverted Jenny on eBay. It got some large bids, but when one potential buyer asked to see the stamp before bidding (he was willing to travel to Williams Lake from the U.S.) the seller made some excuse, which of course made the whole thing started to smell like decomposing fish. Eventually it came to light that the "stamp" had been scanned from a philatelic publication. The last thing I heard about it was that the R.C.M.P. was investigating.
Bob
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re: APEX Certificates
Bob,
How interesting. There just happens to be an "inverted jenny" on eBay right now. The owner wants a mere $500,000 and claims it came from a collection. Even shows a scan. Maybe we should copy it and send it to APS for the Quick ID service.
Bye the way: Putting my money "where my mouth or rather where my fingers are." I did send a 292 that I purchased a few weeks ago to APS for their expert opinion. I purchased it from a very reputable dealer and at a very reasonable price given its condition. However, when I looked at the stamp really closely the "one" on the bottom inscription looked a bit off.
We shall see.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
27 Jan 2011
10:31:03am
re: APEX Certificates
" .... Several years ago, a "seller" in Williams Lake, British Columbia tried to sell an Inverted Jenny on eBay. ...."
I remember reading about that incident, Bob. I thought the trusty Mounties apprehended the guy and his defense was something along the line that he was offering exactly what the scan on the eBay auction page showed, to wit; a picture of an inverted Jenny.
It was a few years ago and at home I think I have some of the clippings from Linns Stamp News in a folder somewhere that reported it.
If my feeble mind remembers it I can probably find the folder when I get back to my stamp room and settled in.
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