Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
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Think there could have been earlier issues than 1908 on the west coast?
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I think what you have is a scissors cut Scott 300. Both the top and bottom edges look rough-cut and they aren't parallel (the bottom edge slopes down to the left.
Steve
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What you may have is one of the non Scott listed Covel private perforations. A Filstrup was an officer of this company as well as a big stamp collector during this period. Covel was located down the street from Shermack, so he had them do a private run of unique perforations. Above is one example that is in my collection, and I have a mint pair, and a used single as well. I have seen several other covers over the years. I also have covers of 314 imperfs and Shermack Type 3s as mailed by Covel, and also they must have sent self addressed stamped envelopes to customers since I've seen these on preprinted envelopes addressed to Covel and mailed from various post offices. Your cover could be worth a few hundred dollars.
You will also see the Covel / Filstrup names on philatelic covers up to the late 1930s.
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Very nice...
Are these perforated 12.5?
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On the post card, there appears to be a clean, white line running along the top edge of the stamp. I think it possible that the stamp was removed, trimmed at the top, and then replaced on the card. I think that the bottom of the stamp may just be a straight edge either from a sheet or booklet stamp, but I can detect some gum staining along the bottom to where the stamp may have been trimmed on the bottom as well.
NEVER NEVER NEVER presume that a stamp is the rarest stamp in the listings. READ the warnings in the catalog regarding fakes created to trick collectors. You must first verify beyond a doubt that the stamp in question is not a lower valued stamp.
It doesn't matter how old the collection is that the item came from. That is no guarantee that the stamps in it are all genuine. "The Serrane Guide" was written in 1927 and 1929. It contains information on thousands of counterfeit and fraudulent stamps. The book "Album Weeds" was written about the same time, and is a multi-volume set of even more counterfeit and fraudulent stamps.
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"On the post card, there appears to be a clean, white line running along the top edge of the stamp. I think it possible that the stamp was removed, trimmed at the top, and then replaced on the card. I think that the bottom of the stamp may just be a straight edge either from a sheet or booklet stamp, but I can detect some gum staining along the bottom to where the stamp may have been trimmed on the bottom as well.
NEVER NEVER NEVER presume that a stamp is the rarest stamp in the listings. READ the warnings in the catalog regarding fakes created to trick collectors. You must first verify beyond a doubt that the stamp in question is not a lower valued stamp."
We won't know for sure unless we are able to examine the stamp in person. First, note that I said "may be" because of that. We know it's not 318 because the postmark is prior to the issue date. 314 was issued in 1906, so it is feasible that it's the imperf stamp versus the perforated and common 300. It's not 300B, a booklet stamp because that would have a straight edge on either the left or right side.
I believe the gum smear you detected is due to the sloppy way the stamp was originally affixed to the card. A postcard with 300 on it is very common, in fact you can find them for a dollar or so today. So I don't see anyone faking the stamp on such a poor example of both positioning the stamp, and bad postal marking. Simply, there are many, many better cards to use as the basis of a counterfeit 318, including ones that would fit into the proper date range. And nobody would be counterfeiting a Covel private perf since A. Covel had a big supply of them and were using them for postage way into the 1920s and B. It didn't have any value.
I've bought two of the Covel coils sold as "counterfeit 318" simply because the person doing the appraisal wasn't aware of the Covel coils since they aren't Scott listed. There is a very good chance that the card in question has a Covel coil.
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Well, I certainly hope that you got the good one.
Through the years, it has been a constant barrage on all of the philatelic sites that I have been on where so many have posted pictures of what they claimed to be the rarest of the rare stamps. If those stamps were in fact the rare version, then the rare stamps would be more prevalent than the common varieties of the same stamp.
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I've been collecting this issue specifically since the mid 1970s. I've never seen a 318 in person. That one is the rare one. The Covel coils, although never cataloged, aren't all that rare. The easiest of the 314 private perforation stamps to find is the Shermack Type 3. Some of the others are quite elusive, some of which I've never seen on cover. And after that, most of what I have seen on cover appear to be philatelic usage, such as mail from known stamp dealers or collectors. It would be nice to see the reverse side of the card in question, to see if it was a picture card or a commercial message.
For instance there was a cover for sale on eBay that had three different private perf pairs on it, mailed in the late 1920s by a stamp dealer. Although actually seeing postal usage, I call that a philatelic cover since it was created to please the collector on the receiving end by a philatelist. The fact that the usage is so late and out of the issue date, shows that these stamps weren't considered valuable back then, merely a collectible curiosity. And why I don't see anyone in that era counterfeiting them. And I wasn't paying the $500 asking price for that cover.
The Shermack Type 3s are probably the only variety that saw commercial usage. I have examples on purely commercial covers... aka the junk mail of that era. The Covel coils aren't all that rare, I see them for sale a few times a year. They qualify as kind of commercial use, since Covel used them on their regular mail, but I say "kind of" because Filstrip was a known stamp collector and initiated the issue to satisfy that urge. I have an eBay search for "Covel" and "Filstrip" which turns up items, from usage of imperf stamps through first day covers of the 1930s. In fact when you see the blocks of 6 or more of the 314 imperforate with the oval registered mail cancel, those are from his collection. They are pretty common.
I have posted my opinion on the OPs original question since the only answer they had was "counterfeit" and I wanted them to know the possibility of it being another variety of the stamp, before they tossed it out.
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03:37:44pm
Hello I bought an old time collection put away back in the 40s and 50s and I was just going through some of the covers. This appears to be a scott 318 on a cover. Any opinons would be helpful. The top and bottom where not perffed seem natural. Back when this was sent the rarity of the 318 was not known (1907). In checking on the specialized cat. it says the 318 was issued in 1908? Any help out there? Thanks!!
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03:39:25pm
re: Scott 318 cover?
Think there could have been earlier issues than 1908 on the west coast?
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re: Scott 318 cover?
I think what you have is a scissors cut Scott 300. Both the top and bottom edges look rough-cut and they aren't parallel (the bottom edge slopes down to the left.
Steve
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this post
re: Scott 318 cover?
What you may have is one of the non Scott listed Covel private perforations. A Filstrup was an officer of this company as well as a big stamp collector during this period. Covel was located down the street from Shermack, so he had them do a private run of unique perforations. Above is one example that is in my collection, and I have a mint pair, and a used single as well. I have seen several other covers over the years. I also have covers of 314 imperfs and Shermack Type 3s as mailed by Covel, and also they must have sent self addressed stamped envelopes to customers since I've seen these on preprinted envelopes addressed to Covel and mailed from various post offices. Your cover could be worth a few hundred dollars.
You will also see the Covel / Filstrup names on philatelic covers up to the late 1930s.
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re: Scott 318 cover?
Very nice...
Are these perforated 12.5?
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11:59:44pm
re: Scott 318 cover?
On the post card, there appears to be a clean, white line running along the top edge of the stamp. I think it possible that the stamp was removed, trimmed at the top, and then replaced on the card. I think that the bottom of the stamp may just be a straight edge either from a sheet or booklet stamp, but I can detect some gum staining along the bottom to where the stamp may have been trimmed on the bottom as well.
NEVER NEVER NEVER presume that a stamp is the rarest stamp in the listings. READ the warnings in the catalog regarding fakes created to trick collectors. You must first verify beyond a doubt that the stamp in question is not a lower valued stamp.
It doesn't matter how old the collection is that the item came from. That is no guarantee that the stamps in it are all genuine. "The Serrane Guide" was written in 1927 and 1929. It contains information on thousands of counterfeit and fraudulent stamps. The book "Album Weeds" was written about the same time, and is a multi-volume set of even more counterfeit and fraudulent stamps.
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this post
re: Scott 318 cover?
"On the post card, there appears to be a clean, white line running along the top edge of the stamp. I think it possible that the stamp was removed, trimmed at the top, and then replaced on the card. I think that the bottom of the stamp may just be a straight edge either from a sheet or booklet stamp, but I can detect some gum staining along the bottom to where the stamp may have been trimmed on the bottom as well.
NEVER NEVER NEVER presume that a stamp is the rarest stamp in the listings. READ the warnings in the catalog regarding fakes created to trick collectors. You must first verify beyond a doubt that the stamp in question is not a lower valued stamp."
We won't know for sure unless we are able to examine the stamp in person. First, note that I said "may be" because of that. We know it's not 318 because the postmark is prior to the issue date. 314 was issued in 1906, so it is feasible that it's the imperf stamp versus the perforated and common 300. It's not 300B, a booklet stamp because that would have a straight edge on either the left or right side.
I believe the gum smear you detected is due to the sloppy way the stamp was originally affixed to the card. A postcard with 300 on it is very common, in fact you can find them for a dollar or so today. So I don't see anyone faking the stamp on such a poor example of both positioning the stamp, and bad postal marking. Simply, there are many, many better cards to use as the basis of a counterfeit 318, including ones that would fit into the proper date range. And nobody would be counterfeiting a Covel private perf since A. Covel had a big supply of them and were using them for postage way into the 1920s and B. It didn't have any value.
I've bought two of the Covel coils sold as "counterfeit 318" simply because the person doing the appraisal wasn't aware of the Covel coils since they aren't Scott listed. There is a very good chance that the card in question has a Covel coil.
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02:31:37am
re: Scott 318 cover?
Well, I certainly hope that you got the good one.
Through the years, it has been a constant barrage on all of the philatelic sites that I have been on where so many have posted pictures of what they claimed to be the rarest of the rare stamps. If those stamps were in fact the rare version, then the rare stamps would be more prevalent than the common varieties of the same stamp.
Login to Like
this post
re: Scott 318 cover?
I've been collecting this issue specifically since the mid 1970s. I've never seen a 318 in person. That one is the rare one. The Covel coils, although never cataloged, aren't all that rare. The easiest of the 314 private perforation stamps to find is the Shermack Type 3. Some of the others are quite elusive, some of which I've never seen on cover. And after that, most of what I have seen on cover appear to be philatelic usage, such as mail from known stamp dealers or collectors. It would be nice to see the reverse side of the card in question, to see if it was a picture card or a commercial message.
For instance there was a cover for sale on eBay that had three different private perf pairs on it, mailed in the late 1920s by a stamp dealer. Although actually seeing postal usage, I call that a philatelic cover since it was created to please the collector on the receiving end by a philatelist. The fact that the usage is so late and out of the issue date, shows that these stamps weren't considered valuable back then, merely a collectible curiosity. And why I don't see anyone in that era counterfeiting them. And I wasn't paying the $500 asking price for that cover.
The Shermack Type 3s are probably the only variety that saw commercial usage. I have examples on purely commercial covers... aka the junk mail of that era. The Covel coils aren't all that rare, I see them for sale a few times a year. They qualify as kind of commercial use, since Covel used them on their regular mail, but I say "kind of" because Filstrip was a known stamp collector and initiated the issue to satisfy that urge. I have an eBay search for "Covel" and "Filstrip" which turns up items, from usage of imperf stamps through first day covers of the 1930s. In fact when you see the blocks of 6 or more of the 314 imperforate with the oval registered mail cancel, those are from his collection. They are pretty common.
I have posted my opinion on the OPs original question since the only answer they had was "counterfeit" and I wanted them to know the possibility of it being another variety of the stamp, before they tossed it out.
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