Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
From Wikipedia:
"In 1955, approximately 150 coloured triangular or rectangular stamp forgeries by New York and Munich stamp dealer Henry Stolow (1901–1971) appeared on the market without a date of issue. These stamp issues were printed in the Österreichische Staatsdruckerei without verification of their legality. These issues do not bear any hint of their date of issue, as German stamps do, for example. Therefore it is completely futile to assign them to specific years of issue, as is sometimes done. They were never used for postage, so there are only mint copies."
In 1991, Peter Doerling wrote: “...in 1954, some gentlemen appeared at the Vienna Staatsdruckerei, among them a German stamp dealer, who wanted to have stamps printed for the new REPUBLIC MALUKU SELATAN. In fact, this republic was proclaimed on the Indonesian Moluccas islands of Ambon and Ceram, whose Christian inhabitants no longer wanted to be part of the Islamic republic of Indonesia. The republic was in existence for only a short time; warships fired on Ambonia and many inhabitants fled to the Netherlands. Of course, this was only a pretense for the speculators, because they ordered about 150 stamp issues, among them a lot of beautiful animal and plant themes as well as a UN series, all of them merely fantasy issues without any philatelic value.â€
"Respected stamp catalogs and stamp dealers do not sell stamps from the Republic Maluku Selatan. No valid stamps from that region are known to the Michel editorial department."
Regarding the coloured stamp issues sold since 1955, the Michel editorial department stated:“They are merely bogus stamps, which cannot be found in any respectable catalogue, and should not be offered by any dealer who wants to be regarded as reputable – unless under the explicit description of "bogus stamp".
So, if anyone should try to sell you any of these stamps, offer the Brooklyn Bridge in exchange for them....
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09:45:59pm
Don
Such issues are called "Cinderellas" and are a legitimate collecting field. Much has been discussed regarding Cinderellas on this board over the years. There is an excellent website encompassing The Richard C. Witt Cinderella Reference Collection
CLICK HERE to examine the world of Cinderellas
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I know a little about Cinderellas (I'm actually the proud owner of a Tunis-Alger cover and some mint copies of the stamps), but why was this particular issue condemned so harshly by Michel's? Was it perceived as an intentional dupe of the philatelic community?
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Could we see an image of your Tunis-Alger cover, please?
Bob
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While these stamps aren't postage stamps, they look like stamps and could have served as stamps but for armed force exerted on South Moluccan Christians who were seeking independence from largely-Muslim Indonesia. Are they collectible? It depends….
I don't think anything all should be labelled as "collectible" or "un-collectible". While the examples at hand, the South Moluccan cinderellas, have little commercial value, I see them as valuable artifacts particularly representative of the political history of Indonesia since the Second World War, and generally representative of the history of European colonialism in Southeast Asia. Granted, there was no doubt some plain old greed involved in creating the Moluccan cinderellas, but what modern stamp hasn't involved some sort of greed in the decision to produce it?
I have a number of cinderellas in my collection. In every case, I purchased them because they serve to illustrate points that I wish to make in web pages or exhibits. I use photographs, maps, collector cards, tickets, brochures, timetables, newspaper clippings, and even dried flowers in the same way. A dried poppy in a 1917 soldier's letter from Flanders in 1917 certainly is not philatelic, but I'm not about to throw it away because isn't "collectible".
Bob
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Thanks, Bob....
I was a little derailed by Michel's rather ferocious condemnation of the issue. I appreciate the perspective. So much for 'authorities'....
Here's the cover I mentioned: It's Alger-Tunis, of course; the Tunis-Alger return flight was never made; my bad.
If anyone has unused copies (that's all there are) of the Tunis-Alger issue, I'd be interested. I'm missing the 1F and 2F issues.
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For what it's worth I came across a 20 s imperf REPUBLIK MALUKU SELATAN just today as I was going through a mish mash of world wide stamps.The label is an imperf, a color of light brown, a match to the one posted by the OP.I just put it in the Indo Asia bag-o-stuff, not giving it much thought, dug it out after reading this post.
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So, the Alger-Tunis stamps were issued, but never used, so your cover is bogus. But interesting, and not "worthless" if this Buy-it-now eBay offering, for only EUR 79.00 is any guide:
Not long ago, I mentioned another cover in my collection; it was salvaged from a British ship, S.S. Eros, which was torpedoed in May, 1940 by a German U-boat. A member of my stamp club criticized me because of what I pad (A couple of hundred dollars if I recall correctly), saying that if I had waited, I would probably find another from the same incident for a lot less money. Well, I wanted it when I saw it! I didn't want to wait for something that might never happen, and in fact, I've only seen two or three others since then, only a little cheaper and less desirable (fewer postal markings, labels, etc.). I just don't believe that price is equivalent to value when it comes to philatelic material. Of course, for common items, there's no point in spending more than necessary. And that cover has given me a lot for the price: I've written two articles about it, included it as an important part of an exhibit, and learned a great deal about Germany's U-boat operations and the Allies' countermeasures.
Bob
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No, Bob, you misunderstood: The Alger-Tunis flight was actually made and carried mail; the stamps had not been issued officially, so they remain Cinderellas (see another post on the subject by Terry in 'Africa/All : Algeria: Scott Unlisted Airmail Issues').
It's the Tunis-Alger flight that wasn't made-- the return flight. The stamps printed for this flight actually read 'Tunis' on the left side and 'Alger' on the right side, while the stamps made for the actual flight read the opposite, as shown on both our examples. All existing Tunis-Alger stamps are mint/unused. I haven't heard of anyone trying to fake a cover of those.... of course, anything is possible.
Here are examples of stamps intended for each flight:
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....and, yes, the eBay offer of about $100 US is the present average for this cover. I believe only a couple of hundred letters were on that flight.
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The story of the cover from the S.S. Eros is fascinating. There's a good one from this cover, also-- which is why I bought it. Terry's posts pretty much cover (heh-heh) all the known facts, so I won't re-post the info here.
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Just an FYI post-- here's some stuff I learned while trying to run down some stamps that appeared in my collection (probably as a 'gift' included with another purchase-- I don't buy stamps printed after WWII, generally).
From Wikipedia:
"In 1955, approximately 150 coloured triangular or rectangular stamp forgeries by New York and Munich stamp dealer Henry Stolow (1901–1971) appeared on the market without a date of issue. These stamp issues were printed in the Österreichische Staatsdruckerei without verification of their legality. These issues do not bear any hint of their date of issue, as German stamps do, for example. Therefore it is completely futile to assign them to specific years of issue, as is sometimes done. They were never used for postage, so there are only mint copies."
In 1991, Peter Doerling wrote: “...in 1954, some gentlemen appeared at the Vienna Staatsdruckerei, among them a German stamp dealer, who wanted to have stamps printed for the new REPUBLIC MALUKU SELATAN. In fact, this republic was proclaimed on the Indonesian Moluccas islands of Ambon and Ceram, whose Christian inhabitants no longer wanted to be part of the Islamic republic of Indonesia. The republic was in existence for only a short time; warships fired on Ambonia and many inhabitants fled to the Netherlands. Of course, this was only a pretense for the speculators, because they ordered about 150 stamp issues, among them a lot of beautiful animal and plant themes as well as a UN series, all of them merely fantasy issues without any philatelic value.â€
"Respected stamp catalogs and stamp dealers do not sell stamps from the Republic Maluku Selatan. No valid stamps from that region are known to the Michel editorial department."
Regarding the coloured stamp issues sold since 1955, the Michel editorial department stated:“They are merely bogus stamps, which cannot be found in any respectable catalogue, and should not be offered by any dealer who wants to be regarded as reputable – unless under the explicit description of "bogus stamp".
So, if anyone should try to sell you any of these stamps, offer the Brooklyn Bridge in exchange for them....
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They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -Benjamin Franklin
26 Nov 2014
09:45:59pm
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
Don
Such issues are called "Cinderellas" and are a legitimate collecting field. Much has been discussed regarding Cinderellas on this board over the years. There is an excellent website encompassing The Richard C. Witt Cinderella Reference Collection
CLICK HERE to examine the world of Cinderellas
Login to Like
this post
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
I know a little about Cinderellas (I'm actually the proud owner of a Tunis-Alger cover and some mint copies of the stamps), but why was this particular issue condemned so harshly by Michel's? Was it perceived as an intentional dupe of the philatelic community?
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this post
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
Could we see an image of your Tunis-Alger cover, please?
Bob
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re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
While these stamps aren't postage stamps, they look like stamps and could have served as stamps but for armed force exerted on South Moluccan Christians who were seeking independence from largely-Muslim Indonesia. Are they collectible? It depends….
I don't think anything all should be labelled as "collectible" or "un-collectible". While the examples at hand, the South Moluccan cinderellas, have little commercial value, I see them as valuable artifacts particularly representative of the political history of Indonesia since the Second World War, and generally representative of the history of European colonialism in Southeast Asia. Granted, there was no doubt some plain old greed involved in creating the Moluccan cinderellas, but what modern stamp hasn't involved some sort of greed in the decision to produce it?
I have a number of cinderellas in my collection. In every case, I purchased them because they serve to illustrate points that I wish to make in web pages or exhibits. I use photographs, maps, collector cards, tickets, brochures, timetables, newspaper clippings, and even dried flowers in the same way. A dried poppy in a 1917 soldier's letter from Flanders in 1917 certainly is not philatelic, but I'm not about to throw it away because isn't "collectible".
Bob
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likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
Thanks, Bob....
I was a little derailed by Michel's rather ferocious condemnation of the issue. I appreciate the perspective. So much for 'authorities'....
Here's the cover I mentioned: It's Alger-Tunis, of course; the Tunis-Alger return flight was never made; my bad.
If anyone has unused copies (that's all there are) of the Tunis-Alger issue, I'd be interested. I'm missing the 1F and 2F issues.
Login to Like
this post
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
For what it's worth I came across a 20 s imperf REPUBLIK MALUKU SELATAN just today as I was going through a mish mash of world wide stamps.The label is an imperf, a color of light brown, a match to the one posted by the OP.I just put it in the Indo Asia bag-o-stuff, not giving it much thought, dug it out after reading this post.
Login to Like
this post
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
So, the Alger-Tunis stamps were issued, but never used, so your cover is bogus. But interesting, and not "worthless" if this Buy-it-now eBay offering, for only EUR 79.00 is any guide:
Not long ago, I mentioned another cover in my collection; it was salvaged from a British ship, S.S. Eros, which was torpedoed in May, 1940 by a German U-boat. A member of my stamp club criticized me because of what I pad (A couple of hundred dollars if I recall correctly), saying that if I had waited, I would probably find another from the same incident for a lot less money. Well, I wanted it when I saw it! I didn't want to wait for something that might never happen, and in fact, I've only seen two or three others since then, only a little cheaper and less desirable (fewer postal markings, labels, etc.). I just don't believe that price is equivalent to value when it comes to philatelic material. Of course, for common items, there's no point in spending more than necessary. And that cover has given me a lot for the price: I've written two articles about it, included it as an important part of an exhibit, and learned a great deal about Germany's U-boat operations and the Allies' countermeasures.
Bob
Login to Like
this post
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
No, Bob, you misunderstood: The Alger-Tunis flight was actually made and carried mail; the stamps had not been issued officially, so they remain Cinderellas (see another post on the subject by Terry in 'Africa/All : Algeria: Scott Unlisted Airmail Issues').
It's the Tunis-Alger flight that wasn't made-- the return flight. The stamps printed for this flight actually read 'Tunis' on the left side and 'Alger' on the right side, while the stamps made for the actual flight read the opposite, as shown on both our examples. All existing Tunis-Alger stamps are mint/unused. I haven't heard of anyone trying to fake a cover of those.... of course, anything is possible.
Here are examples of stamps intended for each flight:
Login to Like
this post
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
....and, yes, the eBay offer of about $100 US is the present average for this cover. I believe only a couple of hundred letters were on that flight.
Login to Like
this post
re: South Moluccas or Malaku Seratan
The story of the cover from the S.S. Eros is fascinating. There's a good one from this cover, also-- which is why I bought it. Terry's posts pretty much cover (heh-heh) all the known facts, so I won't re-post the info here.
Login to Like
this post